Autoweek review of the GTR

[G35cJ]

Here is the review from Autoweek:

U.S. buyers will get the 2009 Nissan GT-R late next spring.
By MARK VAUGH
Yes, it lives up to all the hype!
The coming Nissan GT-R is a world-class supercar: Top speed of 193 mph, 0-60 in 3.5 seconds, a 473 hp, 433 lb ft twin-turbo V6 mounted in the front and driving all four wheels through a rear-mounted transaxle. Take a breath. Okay, continue. And a dual-clutch six-speed automatic you can operate via paddles on the steering wheel.

After a full day driving it on the Nurburgring, the Autobahn and up and over numerous little German country roads we can easily say this is one car that was not over hyped. It is truly a world-class supercar on par with, if not just ahead of, the iconic Porsche Turbo. (They had a Porsche Turbo on hand, too, and we thought the GT-R felt better tied down.)

But it's one thing to put a license plate on a race car and call it streetable. Chief engineer Kazutoshi Mizuno said the new GT-R was designed and engineered as an all-around, all-season, all-weather car that is comfortable to drive every day, even at normal speeds on a normal day.

During the few minutes we drove at what could be called a "normal pace" that day we'd have to say we agree with him. But given only a few hours at the wheel of this, the most highly anticipated supercar in years, we were only in "normal" mode for very brief spurts. The rest of the time we were at some level between "pushing it" and "hammering on the mutha'."

Our first time behind the wheel was on the A48 autobahn in Germany somewhere out around Koblenz or Koln or some other K-town where the German socialist government had not yet succeeded in adding those awful 120-km-hr speed limits. It was like Bonneville with elevation changes and guardrails. The only limitation out here was aerodynamic. Hence, we were obliged to go all-out whompin' fast the whole time.

Rolling right out of the autobahn rest stop where we rendezvoused with the Japanese engineering support crew, we nailed the throttle to the floor and man did the throttle respond. The 3.8-liter VR38 V6 is "an evolution" of the award-winning VQ engine family. It sits up front, with two of its six cylinders forward of the front axle and four aft. Two bagel-sized IHI turbos sit right at the exhaust manifold for quick response. The 433 lb ft of torque rails across the tach from 3200 to 5200 rpm. Peak 473 hp comes at 6400 revs.

A carbon fiber prop shaft ("Good damping and stiffness") runs back to the transaxle, incorporating the clutch, transmission and transaxle altogether. The shifting is done via a direct, twin-clutch system. One clutch handles the odd gears and another clutch handles the even ones. Shifts take 0.2 seconds. There are BorgWarner triple-cone synchronizers for all gears. Another shaft runs forward from that transaxle to send power to the front wheels. Below 25 mph the torque split is 50/50, above that, under normal driving, the split is 40/60. But it can split up to 2/98 under hard acceleration, which was what we were giving it.

Our car rode on 20-inch wheels wrapped by Bridgestone Potenza RE070s, 255/40 in front and 285/35 rears. Front suspension was upper and lower A-arms and the rear was a five-link.

[G35cJ]

It's always fun to go from zero to warp factor in a right hand-drive car using a jet-lagged left hand-drive brain, trying not to turn on the windshield wipers when you think you're hitting the turn signal.

The GT-R lists quarter-mile time at 11.7 seconds and entering the Autobahn we had no reason to doubt that. The turbo boost was, as promised, very progressive, with little or no discernable lag, just smooth, even power delivery.

Despite the late-morning hour and the mid-week day, there were still a few cars in the way. When we eased onto the 15.2-inch ventilated cross-drilled Brembo brakes from well into triple-digit speeds the car slowed without drama. But then traffic would clear out and the GT-R resumed its high velocity chase with ease.

There are three settings for the Bilstein Damptronic shocks: R, Sports and Comfort. We went out in Sports.

Top speed is listed at 193 mph but with traffic the best we could do was 176. You wouldn't try that in any country but Germany, where you can usually assume everyone else is paying attention. There was a Japanese engineer riding shotgun over on the left whom we dubbed "Bushido engineer-o" or brave engineer. He thought that was pretty funny.

While the coefficient of drag is an impressive 0.27, more than almost any production car, the GT-R also produces downforce at each axle, something very few production cars can claim.

"Cd is more important than downforce on a G35," said chief designer Hiroshi Hasegawa. "But in the case of the GT-R we have to make downforce."

At 193 mph you might appreciate that philosophy.

The first time we went out, the right front wheel felt just a little out of balance, so we came back in and they changed all four wheels. They're efficient, these guys. After that the car was smooth as well as stable and safe, due in equal parts to the German roadway and the Japanese engineering.

The whole car sits on the new PM platform, PM meaning Prime Midship. It's an evolution of the ubiquitous FM platform that sits underneath everything from 350Zs to crossover SUVs. The PM incorporates what Mizuno-san called a "hybrid superstructure body." There is carbon-injected material in the front end and carbon composite material underneath for aerodynamic downforce. There's even some polypropylene in the body, too. In any case, it's not just another FM variant.

We truly enjoyed the Autobahn experience. This is the perfect car for such a top-speed run-it gives such a sense of control at those speeds that you feel like you could do anything.

Next on our agenda of "anything" were some miles of country road. We were able to drive the GT-R back-to-back with a Porsche Turbo.

"Okay now, please enjoy," said the Nissan technician as we exited the company compound down the street from the Nurburgring.

After "much spirited driving," we can say the Turbo had a good deal more lag and more dive and squat than the GT-R. But once the Porsche got spooled up, achtung, baby. It felt lighter and the steering felt quicker, too. The biggest difference between the two was that the Turbo demanded more of its driver while the GT-R was easier to handle, flatter and more stable. We'd be happy with either one, if you're considering a birthday present or anything.

Next up on this Disneyland of a day was Der Nurburgring. This is what all those teenagers whose parents have not taken away their Playstation access really want to do: drive an actual GT-R around the actual Nurburgring as fast as grip, guts and gasoline allow.

Man-oh-flippin'-man. The real deal is about 100 times more thrilling than any computer simulation, even those with the little plastic steering wheel and feet pedals attached.

This was the new Nurburgring, too. Nissan wasn't foolish enough to turn this small squadron of car writer hacks loose on the narrow, blind, crazy-dangerous Nordschliefe. At the time of our drive there were only three prototype GT-Rs extant in the world, and all the apologizing on Earth wouldn't bring one back if you crunched it.

The new Nurburgring is faster, with wide, sweeping turns bordered by runoff areas so huge that even the most no-talent buffoon could likely stay on the pavement. So we did.

All the Japanese engineers and executives had been telling everyone that there was a 35-mph speed limit in the pits, but in all the excitement we kind of forgot about it and nailed the throttle right out of the parking spot right there in pit lane. The wide, low, squealing run-flat tires laid down long patches of black rubber as we launched past the closed garages, pulling back on the right paddle to shift the rear-mounted dual-clutch six-speed transaxle every time the engine got close to its 7000-rpm redline.

In no time at all we were roaring onto pit-out near the end of the straight and directly into the low, evening sun. By the time we got fully out on the front straight and were shifting up from four to five or so, the sun was directly in front of the GT-R and streaming into the windshield; we were trying to remember if that first right-hander came at this rise or just past it. It was just past it, but we'd already started braking and downshifting, the GR6's "synchro-rev control," which perfectly matched each downshift with a throttle blip much better than we'd ever have been able to match it.

Tiptoeing through the first couple turns to avoid the infamy of the run-off gravel, the car felt perfectly safe and willing. So we hammered it up through the gears down the hill and to the far 180-degree turn and started to feel more confident. By the end of the first lap we were flat out on the front straight, roaring up through all six gears for all it was worth.

Nissan lists lateral g's at 0.99, and we certainly bumped up against that in many a Nurburgring corner.

We only got three full laps and no one was timing us, so you'll just have to assume we set the lap record. Earlier, Mizuno-san had offered some lap times from the Nordschliefe for various cars driven by the German magazine SportAuto. Those times are driver-dependent, track-knowledge-dependent, weather-, traffic- and bunny-crossing-the-track dependent. But Mizuno suggested the GT-R could get anywhere from 7:44 on up, with most laps coming in between 7:55 and 7:58. So he suggested the GT-R's strong suit was that it offered "the best cost per lap time." For whatever that's worth.

The GT-R will be worth somewhere in the low-$70,000 range, which does make it perhaps the best cost per lap. We'll know for sure when it enters U.S. showrooms in May or June. Japan will get first crack at it, we get second and the Europeans, who did such a great job of getting out of our way during our Autobahn drive, will have to get it third.


SPECS: 2009 Nissan GT-R
On Sale: May/June

Base Price: Low 70s

Drivetrain: 3.8-liter, 473-hp, 433-lb-ft twin turbocharged V6; awd, six-speed automatic

Curb Weight: 3792 pounds

0-60: 3.5 seconds

Fuel Economy (EPA Combined): 21 mpg (mfg. target)

[G-WannaBe]

There you have it. This will probably sell in the $80s after markup.


Too bad, i'm out. There is no way I can justify that much green... I guess mid 50s was nothing more then an internet pipe dream. Might as well buy the new '08 vette and add some performance mods, it's already over 430 hp off the showroom floor, and that for what, $45k? It may be less of a total car in some ways, maybe even more then a few, but how much more performance can the avg. buyer afford? Sure we could all leverage every account we have to buy way out of our range, but very few people can manage that.

(NOT TRYING TO GET INTO ANY DEBATES OVER QUALITY, FIT, FINISH, OR EVEN WHO WOULD BEAT WHO TO THE LINE, PURE DOLLAR PER HP GETS YOU OUT ON TOP WITH A CHEVY NO MATTER HOW YOU SLICE IT)

Nice try GTR, i know your gunning for the 911, but @ 80k, you just shot past the purchase price of many would be owners, including me. Even $55 would be a far reach, but may have been worth it if I could have actually put this in my garage.

[jawjaw]

Yeah, too expensive IMO. I was thinking it would be $50k or so - like corvette money. It sounds like an awesome machine and all but so are many cars in the $70k+ price range. I wonder how many people will pass the Porsche, BMW, Merc, Audi dealers to go to Nissan.

[CalsonicVQ]

If the American Z06 starts at $71k, I don't see any reason why the MSRP of the Japanese GTR can't also start in the low $70's.

IMO, I think it would be horrible if all $50k car buyers could afford the GTR. Soon, you'd see loads of GTRs on the road. It would definitely lose some exclusivity. $70-80k is good - expensive enough that not too many people can afford it, but not overpriced so that only millionaires can comfortably afford one.

Better start pinching more pennies, G-WannaBe...

[darnelled]

NICE find.Thanks.
Way out of my range too, but maybe it'll be a little less if found used in 2 years. Still 70k is a bargain compared to the 911T.

[G-WannaBe]

Originally Posted by CalsonicVQ

IMO, I think it would be horrible if all $50k car buyers could afford the GTR. Soon, you'd see loads of GTRs on the road. It would definitely lose some exclusivity. $70-80k is good - expensive enough that not too many people can afford it, but not overpriced so that only millionaires can comfortably afford one.

Better start pinching more pennies, G-WannaBe...

By your description, we should see loads of M3's, S4's, Z4Ms, or Shelby GTs all over the place, and in some high end areas, I would almost agree, but 'loads' of $50,000 cars do not drive around anywhere I look. And I live about 1 hour away from 1 of the richest town's in the East, and constantly in top 10 lists across the whole country. (Greenwich, CT).

I know they are chasing rare supercars to start: 911s have, in part, the appeal they have because of exclusivity. In order to catch some of those sales, they cannot make 10,000 copies. But, that is also why they are making 3 lines, so that an 'affordable' low end model is made available. This is the level that should start closer to the M3s, S5s, and S4s.

Will Nissan get a buyer to jump from a luxury sports car BRAND, well established, just to have something new and / or more HP?

This car is not going to eat the lunch of current $85,000 cars. This level of luxury does not exist in the eyes of many buyers for Nissan to support it.

CASE IN POINT: Look at the high end Phaeton VW tried and failed to sell recently, they were good cars, and aguably worth the cash, (basically the car was a rebadge of the highest end Audi A8 http://www.carsdirect.com/research/c...,USB60AUC041B0 ) but no one would pay that much for the VW brand, $101,000??? They had to stop making it due to low sales. It was not the car, it was the brand, if you dont have the value in buyers eyes, you won't sell much, especially @ 85k. That is brand building 101.

Many buyers love the history and the credentials the GTR is coming over with, but those same buyers are not the ones with $85k to spend on a car.

IMO, i can save all the pennies i find, would i buy this @ 85k? it would lead me right to all the cars @ that price for a serious comparaision. in the end i am not sure i would buy the gtr @ that price. @ 60k, it would get more attention of the crowd that knows it and can afford it, @ 80k or above, i think it has priced itself out of its own market.

Good luck nissan, I would like to see this car do really well, and it would be a kick in the azz to own one, but how many of you would pass up the other possibilities @ 85K for this car???

[N50]

No matter the price I would try every car on the market at my targeted price point. I have a very specific want for my next vehicle. Coupe and AWD. That gives me the TT and 3 Series as lesser (price) options right of the bat. However, I like exclusivity and I could care less about the badge (Hence I bought an Infiniti FX instead of a BMW X5 or Lexus RX). Thus the GT-R really has my interest.

Bottom line: This is not going to be a huge money maker for Nissan. Supplies will be very limited. I do think they will sell just because of the "performance for the money" aspect. That's the whole reason the Z06 sells now. People will buy it to say that they own a twin turboed 6 cyl. with nearly 500 hp and a shiet load of torque for peanuts compared to some other brands.

[G-WannaBe]

Good Point N50, and good luck getting 1, they will be low in number i am sure.

[striker3]

I would buy 1. If the 911 is the bench mark and the GTR has exceeded that then it has to be 1 hell of a car. 911 is / has been my dream car.

[striker3]

911 Turbo that is.

[GeeDM]

Even if they are 80K..those bad boys are going to get swallowed up like M&M's when they hit US shores...can you imagine the WHP that will be acheived with top end performance products on this bad boy...just think all the major players will be making parts for this and just to own a GT-R will push most people with the money to pick one up..simple as that.

[CalsonicVQ]

Originally Posted by G-WannaBe

By your description, we should see loads of M3's, S4's, Z4Ms, or Shelby GTs all over the place, and in some high end areas, I would almost agree, but 'loads' of $50,000 cars do not drive around anywhere I look. And I live about 1 hour away from 1 of the richest town's in the East, and constantly in top 10 lists across the whole country. (Greenwich, CT).

I know they are chasing rare supercars to start: 911s have, in part, the appeal they have because of exclusivity. In order to catch some of those sales, they cannot make 10,000 copies. But, that is also why they are making 3 lines, so that an 'affordable' low end model is made available. This is the level that should start closer to the M3s, S5s, and S4s.

Will Nissan get a buyer to jump from a luxury sports car BRAND, well established, just to have something new and / or more HP?

This car is not going to eat the lunch of current $85,000 cars. This level of luxury does not exist in the eyes of many buyers for Nissan to support it.

CASE IN POINT: Look at the high end Phaeton VW tried and failed to sell recently, they were good cars, and aguably worth the cash, (basically the car was a rebadge of the highest end Audi A8 http://www.carsdirect.com/research/c...,USB60AUC041B0 ) but no one would pay that much for the VW brand, $101,000??? They had to stop making it due to low sales. It was not the car, it was the brand, if you dont have the value in buyers eyes, you won't sell much, especially @ 85k. That is brand building 101.

Many buyers love the history and the credentials the GTR is coming over with, but those same buyers are not the ones with $85k to spend on a car.

IMO, i can save all the pennies i find, would i buy this @ 85k? it would lead me right to all the cars @ that price for a serious comparaision. in the end i am not sure i would buy the gtr @ that price. @ 60k, it would get more attention of the crowd that knows it and can afford it, @ 80k or above, i think it has priced itself out of its own market.

Good luck nissan, I would like to see this car do really well, and it would be a kick in the azz to own one, but how many of you would pass up the other possibilities @ 85K for this car???

I live in CA and often see many higher end BMWs, Mercedes, and Audis.

You keep saying $85k, but it's not fair to count the dealer markup that's initially bound to happen. Although, who knows after options and what not? I'll give you that.

Right now I'm thinking of another exclusive Japanese car, the NSX. It started at high $80k-low $90k and it did not do so well. I think the GTR has much more potential since the price starts much lower and definitely has a greater following and bigger status.

What was the MSRP for the R33 and R34 GTRs in Japan compared to the rest of their cars? Granted it's not the US market, but that still might give a slight indication of well the R35 will do in terms of sales.

[flipa77]

I agree with G-Wannabe 80K range is too much for the GTR. I would think about it if it was in the high 50K range, but for 80K I would look for other cars first.

[ghost30]

I could see 60k. 80k seems too steep.. and this is for the entry level one? How much will the evo version be? 110k I suppose.

How much will the Audi RS-5 be?