For all those who have had experience with insurance companies and repairing their vehicles following a collision, I have a story to tell and questions to ask. Don't bother taking a seat; this won't take long.

Last Saturday, I was travelling on I-95 southbound from Philly to Washington, DC when I came to a full stop due to a traffic jam. Immediately after doing so, I was rear-ended by a Chevy pickup and bounced into an Accord sitting in front of me. Following this an Elantra proceeded to bury itself under the Chevy's rear. A duo of state troopers stopped by and took a report, which will be available by the end of this week. Currently I am left with a demolished rear, a scratched front bumper, and one epileptic blinker .

For those knowledgable about making insurance claims, I would appreciate your help on several issues. I have insurance with Allstate and already made a claim with them. I could have waited to for the police report to come out and proceeded to call the "at-fault" party's insurer (at this time, I am not sure if the police pegged the Chevy, the Elantra, or both as the culprits) but I decided not to take the chance of too large a time lapse. My questions are:

Should I have the car taken to the dealership for repairs or Allstate's recommended "pro-shops"? (My agent tells me that if i go with the dealership, I am cut a one-time check and that's it. Alternatively, if I go with the "pro-shop" then theoretically any subsequent problems relating to the accident after the initial repair will be covered)

Is frame damage a viable topic to argue about with Allstate's adjustor/appraiser? (I feel that the integrity of the car's frame may be weakened and that I might want into looking for replacement/compensation)

Are there some parts/issues that the adjustor/appraiser may not look closely at (either due his desire to minimize his appraisal or just something that he may not consider)?

Some details on the damage: the trunk was bent and no longer can be closed, spoiler ripped off, both taillights are cracked/destroyed, rear bumper completely crushed. The trunk's interior is bent upwards (bottom bent upwards, causing spare tire to push up as well).

Many thanks in advance to all those that can help. It's much appreciated!

 

Hwa,
First let me say how sorry I am for your car, but glad you were not hurt.

I worked for a body shop for about a year as a bookkeeper, and covered the front desk for awhile. It has been a couple years but the following information is what I learned there.

The shop was an Allstate contracted shop, meaning if that shop does the repair the work is guaraneed: meaning as long as you own the car any problems arising that are from the accident will be fixed. Now sometimes proving that is tricky. When you take the car to an Allstate shop an adjustor will go to the shop, meet with a service writer and they will do a "tear-down" on the vehicle and create an estimate for repairs. If that shop does the repairs and they find additional damage inside that wasn't on the estimate they will do a "change-order" for additional cost to repair that damage. It's very common to come across more damage than the tear-down shows once they start the work.
Now if you take it to a non-contracted shop an Allstate adjustor will do a tear-down with a service writer again and that estimate is what they will cut the check for. If additional damage is found it's out of pocket for you. You can try to submit that to Allstate but there is no guarantee you will get reimbursed. As far as the frame damage goes, they should put it on a rack either during the tear-down or after and they will change order it if it needs straightening, there are limits to straightening if it's so many degrees out of line they won't mess with it, they will go for a total.

If the damages exceed the value of the car then it starts to get ugly and they start cutting corners to avoid totalling it and thats a whole nightmare!

Sorry this is so long, I hope it helps some. Oh, I'm in Cali. so things might be different in another state. Where are you?
Lisa

 

Lisa,
Thanks for taking the time to provide some insight on this mess. I'm located in Maryland. What you described sounds like the general message that I've been receiving from Allstate so that's pretty much the idea that I'm going on. I'm sorely tempted to take the car to the dealership but that buffer zone provided by using an Allstate-partnered shop is winning me over. While this differs from shop to shop, have you heard most shops doing repairs/replace parts with genuine factory items or do many skip corners by using aftermarket pieces? And if the latter, is there any kind of plausible argument I can utilize to contend this?

 

You need to read through your insurance policy very carefully to see if it states that original parts can be subsituted. I can't remember if Allstate was one of the companies that stated that or not. I know Farmers was hell, everyone would complain about the parts. If you can't find it in the policy, ask an agent what the poicy on original parts is, they should be able to help. Usually they want to use reconditioned or aftermarket if the estimate is too close to the threshold for a total. Our cars hold their value so well you should be okay. Don't be suprised if they end up estimating the removal of everything from the doors back to the bumper, your damage is pretty bad. And the more parts they replace and not just fix is a better repair. Don't be aftraid to ask them questions, stand your ground for original parts and don't take everything the adjustor says as law, you pay his wages! Also be sure to tell your claims person and the body shop to call you when the adjustor goes to look at the car, you have every right to be there for the tear-down and take notes. I used to call customers and let them know when the appointment for their tear-down was so they could be there. You can then relay to the adjustor you want original parts and decide about reconditioned parts if needed.

When my daughter got in an accident with her old sentra I met the adjustor (Gieco) there and we agreed on reconditioned headlights and fender to keep the car from being totalled, it was a 98 sentra with 168,000 miles. The threshold was 3,800. and the damage was 3,500 with reconditioned parts. But it was her first car and I didn't want her in anything nicer, she drives like a girl. lol. It also helped that I knew the adjustor and it was the body shop I used to work at. I'll gladly answer any questions I can for you, dealing with insurance is a pain no matter how good they are.
Lisa

 

sorry to hear man! similar thing happened to me last year; I was doing 40 and girl behind me doing 70. I had AAA insurance (pain to deal with); girl had AIG (great to deal with). I'm pretty sure they used OEM parts. I went to the body shop recommended by dealership -- insurance did not seem to care. Initial estimate was $12K and 4 weeks; took 3.5 months and $17K -- all paid by insurance. shop guaranteed the work as long as I owned the car.

after the initial estimate, my insurance said fix it. so they replaced many parts; basically everything from rear windshield on back (new trunk, quarter panels, etc). even had to cut off damaged frame (on both sides!) and weld on new section. after all that work, AIG said they would have totalled it IF they added cost for rental for 3.5 months to my $17K in damages.

I also filed and got claim for diminished loss of value -- ie, your car is now worth less because of its history. AIG used some formula and paid $2K (on top of paying for repairs). i traded her in a month later (1 yr old, 15K miles, 05 G35X, nav, prem) -- got $25K. there was already rust forming in the trunk where the repairs had been done!!!

whole thing was a complete pain (4 trips back to the shop, dealing with my ins company); hope yours is less painful. kash

 

pics of my accident

http://forums2.freshalloy.com/showth...highlight=kash

kash

 

I'm sorry about your accident.
I'm double sorry that you have Allstate as your insurance company.
I have Metlife as my insurance company and have had 2 accidents and this is how they have handled my cases both time.

The adjuster would come and give a estimate on the perceived damage.
I take that quote to any bodyshop I want my car to be worked on.
Most bodyshops are cool with what the adjusters usually write up.
Now if more damage is found as it was in my last accident my insurance company will either send the adjuster out to re-evaluate or the adjuster will just come straight out and say to fix it and just send them the bill.
My insurance will cut out a check directly to the shop to fix the extra damage . My insurance company has covered all my aftermarket parts (Seibon TS Hood, Racing Hart Wheels, Aftermarket Clutch) as long as they are not more than what OEM parts would cost to buy and spray. They even let me upgrade to the '06 headlights since I was able to get it for almost the same price that they quoted it would cost to repair one.

Every insurance is different. If that is the way Allstate handles its clients I would run.

 

Looks like its time for a seibon trunk, hood, and aftermarket exhaust.

 

Seems that I have a lot of work ahead of me. I spoke with an Allstate rep today and got a list of autobody shops that they work with in the area. I really have no way of knowing their quality of work, so I suppose one is as good as the other. From memory, I've seen many of them passing by and almost all are small shops except for a Honda dealership they apparently work with. Would the latter be preferable or should I just go with any of the others?

 

No Infiniti dealers? I would take it to a dealership before a small mom and pop bodyshop. Just my $.02

 

I am opting to go the safe route and use an Allstate-partnered shop since they provide some form of pseudo-warranty/coverage following the initial repairs.

 

Go to a couple of the shops on the Allstate list and ask for references, if a bodyshop is good they will have no problem giving them to you. Now it might take a day or so if they need an okay to give a customers information with all the new privacy policy's they will need to ask. Don't rush into a decision until you have thoroughly checked out the shops. You are pretty safe with an Allstate shop, we used to have them just pop in and do inspections from our computer software used to bill Allstate jobs all the way thru the shop. Not to say there aren't bad ones out there, just take your time and be comfortable with your decision. You are the victim in this whole nightmare and you are entitled to have your car repaired to your satisfaction and piece of mind. Most ins. companies will let you upgrade to custom parts; ie:hood, body kit, etc. if you are willing to pay difference or if they are less cost than original. Be sure and ask during the estimate/tear-down. Good luck!
Lisa

 

You need to contact your dealers body shop & let them know what Allstate has said. Normally if there is additional damage the body shop just calls & gets it authorized. Some times the ins company will come & check just to be sure. I know in Texas the law is I can take my vehicle wherever I want & the vehicle must be repaired to pre-crash condition.

 

I own/operate two body shops in the Vegas area, so here's my take...

Anywhere you want to have it repaired, Allstate is responsible for ANY and ALL damages related to the accident. They will cut an initial check for the estimated damages, but then the body shop can submit supplements for damages and will have any repairs completed at Allstate's expense. If they only think you need a bumper, deck lid, tail lamps, rebar, impact cushion, and 5hrs of frame time... cool. If they later find out you need the rear floor worked on for a few hours, Allstate must and will provide for the repairs. You are not out-of-pocket for a single dime (except the deductible).

NO MONEY shall come out of your pocket for related damages, other than your deductible. If, in a year, you find that there was related damage, Allstate will pay any shop to complete the repairs. If you later experience accident-related issues that were not listed on the estimate and related supplements, like wiring problems, leaks in your trunk, etc. Allstate must and will pay out on the claim.

Demand OEM parts. Many shops (especially DRPs) will try to get away with used and/or aftermarket parts. Aftermarket parts are non-licensed, typically, and thus are innacurate in at least one dimension in order to comply with international patent law.

Allstate has what they call DRPs (direct repair programs) with certain shops. What that basically means is that those shops offer guarenteed lower labor rates and a 15% parts discount. In exchange, they receive the 'good word' from Allstate. Getting your car repaired at one of their facilities can actually HURT you, as they have incentive to cut costs, use non-OEM parts, etc. to make up the difference created in discounts/rates. I always recommend non-DRP shops, though I know it seems odd.

Go find a couple shops that you like, and pick your favorite based upon what you perceive to be the owner/manager's integrity. If they give you a good, solid estimate (check to make sure they include all fasteners, clips, screws, etc. on their estimate, not just new parts), then tell Allstate you want it repaired there. They will comply, as they must by law.

Here is the tricky part, and one Allstate will try to catch you with: If you get it fixed at a DRP shop, they will warranty the work. If anything happens related to the REPAIR, they will fix it. If the paint chips, the trunk doesn't sit right, etc. Allstate will send someone to fix it.

If you go through a non-DRP shop, Allstate will not cover the repairs... though they will cover additional damage. If the workmanship is shoddy, they don't guarentee it... HOWEVER, 99% of shops have insurance policies and nation-wide guarentees that cover this. If you get your repair done at Joe's Body Shop and it later turns out it stunk, their insurance carrier or the shop itself will cover related repair.

Allstate likes to make you think that you must use their shops, but you don't have to. They will tell you they won't pay out additional repairs (but they do), or will tell you the work isn't guarenteed (which it is, by the shop), or will tell you that they won't cover rental car expenses (which they will). It is 100% your decision, so pick someone you like and go with them. Your agent/adjustor wants you to go with a DRP shop because it saves them money... but you should go with whomever you feel comfortable.

Unless your damages exceed 65% of the value of your car, don't expect it to be totalled-- it's not even an option. Very few companies will pay out 'diminished value', as well, so it's really not worth pursuing.

G

 

When you say that Allstate must complete these subsequent repairs, what kind of backup can I give should they refute my claim?