thanks for all your advice, i'm going to the dealer thismorning. Wish me luck. I'll try my best to explain what you guys told me.

PRO

After explaining to service manager what I learned here, he agreed to take a test drive. What do you know, he couldn't duplicate the grind. I told him not to baby it, he said he was driving "normally." I asked him to shift into 3rd from a stop, he was able to get a little grind, but said that he hadn't depressed the clutch fully.

Still not satisfied, he agreed to have a head tech take a test drive. Same scenario, no luck with grinding 3rd. I tell him, the grind usually occurs during the first drive of the day. He said, it's not right to test cars "cold". Tech could get a grind from a direct shift to 3rd from stop, but said that the gears are still turning, and since you usually don't shift directly into 3rd its not a problem.

I tell them I'll get a 2nd opinion with another dealer.

Now, since my grind only occurs when car is cold, is it fair for them to say its not ok to test cars cold? Also, I noticed both shifting with a slight pause, I told them to shift quicker, but they said they were doing it "normally". As for shifting into 3rd from a standstill, the SM and tech were both able to duplicate this grind, but the SM said he hadn't depressed the clutch fully, and the tech said that even at a stop, the gears are turning so shifting directly to 3rd would grind. Both agreed the tranny was ok.

How do you think their diagnosis sounds? I will get a 2nd opinion, is there a transmission friendly dealer in socal, I know performance nissan is amiable, would they service Gs?

PRO

my dealer will diag whatever problem you describe, cold or hot. That means leaving the car overnight and coming back in the morning (in the loaner). They will reasonably drive anyway you ask to replicate.

Bottomline, this dealership doesnt want the work. Either they are lying about not knowing the trans issues or really havent ever done one... does either sound acceptable? Personally, I'd drive to another dealership. And I'd drive pretty far to have it done right. When you add up the hours of frustation dealing with a dealer that doesnt want to service your car or is incompentent, you end up spend more time than just taking a trip out of town to another dealer. And, most importantly, if they care this little about finding your problem, they wont be any more considerate about fixing it properly.

I'm upset for you at this point... I wish you were here, my dealers service is excellent!

Grinding cold??? Have you ever changed the trans oil?
Ask if they checked the trans oil?
This still sounds suspect to me, it should not grind at all, cold or hot, but low or old gear oil could actually cause grinding, but again in all gears...

I bet there is a problem with that 3rd. gear syncronizer ring, I've heard many stories about people having this problem

I do not know if that Nissan dealer would or even could service your G under warranty, but I know I would call Infiniti on this issue, for sure.

Call 1-800-662-6200, option 7, they will listen and can guide you through this.

It's good to get the view of a pro. As I posted earlier, having changed a clutch twice doesn't make me an expert, but I couldn't understand how a problem in the clutch assembly would manifest itself in only one gear.

If it were me I'd talk to the master tech at the dealership, and ask him why he believes the clutch is the problem. I never pretend to know it all, and I'm willing to learn.

htb,

Whats your professional opinion on the fact that the car grinds when shifting from neutral directly to 3rd at a standstill? Since both the SM and the tech were able to duplicate the grind in this scenario. Wouldn't that in itself show the tranny to be bad? or does the grind have to be from 2nd to 3rd?

PRO

Well, it's been aggravating to say the least, but now Consumer Affairs has agreed to get into the battle with the dealer. It seems most likely I will get my tranny replaced (will find out for sure tomorrow)...but the dealer still says I need to pay for the replacement clutch and flywheel myself. What gives? I thought that since the tranny was bad they have to replace the clutch and the flywheel as well. Everyone who got their tranny replaced...did the dealer make you pay for your clutch and flywheel? Seems like one issue after another!

PRO

DON'T get service done at that dealership. They'll probably harbor some lame animosity towards you for going over their heads. If consumer affairs will back you up, have another dealership do it.

Also, tell them you want to SEE the clutch and flywheel after they pull the tranny to replace it. If it is indeed worn and bad, pay for it (that would be the right thing to do, since it is a wear item). If it ISN'T bad, then they have no reason to charge you. But make sure you have them show you and you should take pics.

Also, if they are going to charge you for the clutch and flywheel (due to wear) then they should have no aversion to putting in a clutch/flywheel of your choice. Get something that doesnt suck. Hell, you're already paying for it, right (if you do, that is).

And last but not least, it is my understanding that when a clutch is worn, you'll get slippage, not grind. Grinds are from synchros not doing it's job when you throw it into a gear.

Sorry it took so long to get back to ya'

They are wrong, the gring from a stand still is sure proof there is some problem, either with travel (which is a slim chance because it would grind going to any gear) or a split or worn sync ring which will gring always if it is split.

Picture this; the sync ring is like a bracelet, you could hold it in your hand and not know it is split, but if you pull the ring a gap will open where it has broken... I've changed many of these back in the days I was a tech.
When you push to shift into a gear it is spinning (if engine is running of course), the ring is tapered and slides toward the engaging gear and the friction slows the spinning gear until the speeds match and then the 2 will fully engage... If the ring is split it will just open when pushed on and will not slow the next spinning gear... This causes the grind as the gears match themselves. This is over simplified to help you to understand what is happening; many techs have changed transmissions but have never rebuilt one.
Soft ring syncronizing is really a very simple process that has been used for a couple of hundred of years.

Sounds like a broken (split) 3rd. gear sync ring to me. and should be under warranty for 70K Miles!

I would let them replace the clutch disc and pressure plate, but insist on having the flywheel surfaced; it is not nessessary to replace that. Do not let them charge you for a flywheel or more than .4 hours extra labor for the clucth. It is a good idea to put a fresh disk & plate while the trans is out.

Thank all you guys for your help. I finally got the call, the dealer said they will replace the tranny with the new revised one and also that this comes with a new clutch disc. However, I will still need to pay parts for the clutch plate and some other misc clutch parts like bearings or something (sorry, i'm not too technical), which comes out to around $270. Didn't know what they were talking about, because I was just elated they were replacing the tranny. They said they didn't think the flywheel would need replacement, however.

Oh yeah, I'm having the service done at Riverside Infiniti. As far as I'm concerned, I will never go back to Montclair...except to *****.

Now, comes the real dilema, should I upgrade the clutch and flywheel now? Pros/Cons? I need to decide on this really soon since they are ordering the tranny now. How much do these cost.

So the moral of this story is, trust the guys on the forums instead of your dealer!

-PRO

Tell the service manager he is an ***. A worn clutch will not in never cause the trans to grind. When the clutch wears you lose less disk thickness and that is what causes a worn clutch to slip. The only time a clutch could cause the trans to grind is if it is Badly and I mean badly warpped.

Ditto here.....replaced at 21K miles. My dealer SUGGESTED I get it replaced before it got worse (and before I installed my Vortech)

Like you said, If it was the clutch, it should grind in every gear.

Go to another dealer.

Sounds like he's way behind the times......go find another dealer with more experience.
To my mind, if the clutch were bad, it would cause a grind in all gears not just 3rd.
G/L
C.

I got mine relplaced with no problems. Dealer said it was fairly common problem. If all else fails, discover infiniti in san diego was the one that replaced mine