I'm not sure if the X has a rear LSD, but if it does not, then the X and the Sport should not be too much different in their snow traction. If the X does not have a rear LSD, then it only has two driven wheels, one front and one rear, the same number as the Sport, but since the Sport has an LSD, both are in the rear.

Should be pretty much a wash.

 

If you can't decide, you can't go wrong with getting the X. Chicago can get pretty bad snow storms. In the winter time, every other time I have a stopover at Chicago's O'Hare airport, I get stuck there for hours or overnight (well, maybe not that bad, but seems like it, and I'm just passing through and don't live there :-) ).

I haven't personally tested the X's stock all season tires with another suppossedly better set of all seasons tires, so I can't comment on how good they are relative to other brands/models. One always has the option of getting better all season tires, and that would still be more convenient than switching to/from summer/winter tires twice a year (and having to get a second set of TPMS sensors or living with the TPMS warning light being on if you don't get sensors for the 2nd set of tires).

Aside: does anyone have any personal experience with a particularly good set of all seasons, that's known to be significantly better than the X's stock tires? If so, what brand, and what do you like about it from personal experience?

When I moved to upstate, NY, I got an AWD (my previous car). I used to live in the Washington, D.C. area, where I really didn't need an AWD. Thus, I haven't had much experience driving RWD in snow conditions. However my friends here who have RWDs (e.g. Corvette and 350z) don't even bother using their cars when there's snow on the ground, based on past experiences, even with winter tires. They have alternate cars, so they have the luxury of not using their RWD and not having to put winters on their RWDs. They've figured that their prefer to take their SUVs or FWD w/ good winter tires than taking out their RWD (and going through the trouble of putting winter tires on them).

Other folks have mentioned that going uphill on RWD w/ winter tires is a lot harder than AWD w/ all-seasons (see other related threads in this forum for more info.).

As far as the talk about "controlled fishtailing", IMO, that's a bunch of baloney. You can lose control when you least expect it, and you're not driving in a track or parking lot for fun - you're likely driving where if you go off by just a few feet, you're likely to hit something.

Someone mentioned that the X's stock tires aren't good in ice? No tires, even the best winter tires do well in solid ice. Ice is ice. But, with the X, you have double the chance of some tires not being in the ice. I mentioned before that I saw a car trying to pull out of a parking space. It was a RWD. It's rear (winter) tires were in snow/ice. It's front tires were in pavement. It couldn't pull out of the parking space. It took 3 guys to push it to get it going.

Yes, it's possible to get a really good set of winter tires for RWD, and for most people most of the time, it should do fine. But it's debatable whether it is even as good as an X with all seasons. Some questions to consider are:

1. If the snow is really bad outside, do you have another car that you can use (e.g. AWD SUV or FWD w/ winters or maybe a car you don't care much about)?

2. Do you have the option of staying at home (e.g. telecommuting) if the snow is really bad outside?

3. Is you commute short and traffic not too bad?

Since you live in Chicago, if you answered "no" to these questions, I'd get an X. You'll always have the option to get winter tires or, if what other folks have said about the X's stock tires is true, a better set of all seasons. Also, for mild winters, you always have the option of being "lazy" and not replacing all-seasons w/ winters, an option you will defintely not have with a RWD.

My previous car was an AWD. The first 3 years, I used all season tires with it. It did fine in the snow, but I was always cautious. Then, I got winter tires. Winter tires _AND_ AWD are an amazingly great combination! You have full confidence. I've driven in really terrible snow storms where you can't see more than 10 feet ahead of you. With AWD and winter tires, my car never had any trouble whatsoever, while other cars around me were sliding, even SUVs and trucks.

Bottom line is, if you live in an area that snows heavily a lot, and this will be your only car for commuting, an X with winter tires is the no-compromise way to go. IMO, an AWD with good all seasons is the next best thing.

Finally, the last question for you is: in the long term, how much will you enjoy and take advantage of the features of the S that the X doesn't have, and do they outweigh the safety of the X?

 

Tons of great points in that post.

 

You can steer all your want... if you don't have traction in the back it won't matter. RWD is superior for handling on dry pavement. But once sleet and snow start to accumulate you can forget about it. I will never forget how I was trying to get on an uphill street in a snow storm with my coupe. The rears did not have enough traction and any attempt to steer the car only made it worse by drifting sideways.

As for the original poster: it all depends on how many snow days you have per year, your exact location (i.e. main st. where roads are plowed vs. some dead end), etc. I for one, live in southern CT (about 35 minutes NE out of NYC). While there are certainly snow days here, they are usually numbered. In addition, the roads are plowed fairly well, so other than on my driveway, I don't encounter too much snow - this made me order the sport. Beside the fact that the Sport model looks better, I just couldn't justify compromising on an AWD when there are simply not enough snow days around here. I would have ultimately ended up with driving an AWD on dry pavement (no snow) about 99% days of the year. Like I said, even when it snows, the streets are plowed - nothing a set of winter tires can't handle.

Good luck with whichever model you choose.

 

Had several good RWD cars before & would not go back to RWD after the X,
You only need to get stuck in snow once to regret getting a RWD.
But, if there's no snow, no need for the X.

 

There's another really nice advantage of having an X. In the middle of winter where I live, it can snow once, twice or three times a week. The local authorities do a very good job of plowing the roads (which is a lot better than where I used to live in Washington, D.C.; aside: there's a good argument for having a good winter car even in more moderate climates like D.C....). However, I don't do a very good job of shoveling my driveway. Oftentimes, I'm in a hurry and don't have the time to shovel my driveway. With the X, no worries. It drives right over the snow. My neighbors always have to keep their driveway clear, but for me, I just drive over the snow, even with many inches of snow in the driveway! It's nice to be able to drive in and out of my driveway, while my neighbors are working hard shoveling their driveway!!

 

I hear ya there. I got stuck in my driveway the morning before I picked up my X because my snow blower was broke. I was trying to back out of my driveway and had to stop due to oncoming traffic. When I tried to continue pulling out, I was stuck. I wasn't actually planning on picking her up that day because of the weather. But after dealing with that, I couldn't wait any longer. After I picked up my X I was wondering how bad it was going to be getting back into my driveway. I didn't have a single problem getting in or out of my driveway and I think we had about 6 to 8 inches of snow the night before plus whatever accumulated during that day. I love this car and I don't think I will ever go back to RWD unless I move.

 

I live in minnesota. I sold my '02 IS300 to get the '07 G35S.

I had snow tires on my IS300 since day one (picked it up in the middle of winter) and the only time I have problems in the winter are in deep deep snow (deep enough to bottom out). It takes some working if I'm stopped in deep snow, but I've never had major problems. Went through 5 minnesota winters without any problems.

This weekend was my first experience with my G in real snow. We got about 5 inches on sat and had about a foot by sunday. I went out sat night and had absolutely no problem navigating the snow. Went on the highway and everything and traction control barely kicked in (i feathered the throttle). The city of st paul didn't plow residential streets until sometime between sun-mon night. During the day sunday I went out for a drive. I was rubbing bottom most of the way in my neighborhood and had to reverse and take running starts through intersections but otherwise, it was fine.

An AWD would probably have had less problems with the starts, but the starts with the RWD were more than handleable. I saw a couple of subaru legacy's and smaller SUVs that had as many problems as I did at the intersections. They basically did the same thing I did. got to the stop sign, looked to make sure it was clear, backed up and took a running start.

One thing to think about, most conditions were safety is a concern is stopping. An AWD vehicle isn't going to stop any better than a RWD vehicle on slippery conditions.

 

There's something to be said about folks who live in cold/snowy climates. Ironically, it's folks from Northern climates who may need AWD less, since they are accustomed to bad winters all the time, unlike those who don't get as many bad winters! I suppose that's a reason why a number of the Canadian folks don't have AWD. On the other hand, folks who only get snow every once in a while aren't as well adept in snow driving, or are surrounded by drivers who can't drive in the snow. Of course, someone from Minnesota who can drive well with non-AWD with winters will even do better with AWD w/ winters! I have a friend who was originally from Minnesota, and he has only ever used FWD with winter tires and has done very well and has never had any problems after many years (though he won't drive his 'vette during the winter).

 

traction is equal whether you have rwd, fwd, or awd. what you do with that traciton is determined by the drivetrain layout

 

Correct. Hence, a FWD in the snow is better because you can steer with the fronts, which also have the power. What is considered crap with FWD on dry pavement (torque steer), can do wonders on snow covered surfaces.

The whole discussion of this thread is snow - e.g. lack or inferior traction. In those situations, FWD is better because you can steer maintain your course easier than with RWD. The fact of the matter is that if you lose traction with RWD, you car starts going sideways because the wheels that steer, are not the ones that propel the car.

 

Interesting perspective, and one that I agree with. When you grow up learning how to drive in poor road conditions, it just becomes second nature I guess. I've managed my entire driving career with mostly RWD vehicles and have always made out fine (I always had winter tires too)

The first winter that I had my 03 G, I made the stupid mistake of keeping the stock all season Turanzas on it. Let's just say that was the FIRST and the LAST time that I will ever drive my primary vehicle with all season tires. Traction sucked and braking was horrendous. That is why I would much rather have my Sport with winter tires than an X with the RSAs. Contrary to what probably alot of you think, where I live we don't really get a lot of snow any more. The roads are bare and dry probably 95% of the time here in the winter.........but I am not jeopardizing my family's life with all season tires for the 5% of the time the roads are crappy.

 

You bring up a good point, which I don't know the answer to, isn't tire selection also dictated by the average temperature in your winter and how the cold affects the compound of the tire - not just the road conditions you happen to be on during a given storm?

 

Yep, your absolutely right. The colder the temps, the less traction an all season tire will have due to the compounds hardening. A pretty good description is below.
http://www.1888articles.com/winter-t...zu908g7q2.html

 

Interesting, explains a lot, thanks. Doesnt average below freezing for the lows too much here here so this is interesting. If I was back home in NH or working in Caribou, Maine it would be a much different story. Grew up driving with snows for almost half the year.