Just doing my research off of your advice/expertise/experience. I've determined if I'm going to lower my G, I'm going to do it right! Which includes a camber kit. So can someone please explain the difference between a control arm, traction arm, toe bolt, a camber bolt, A-arms, rear toe arms, upper/lower arms, adjustable arms. Which ones will I need to adjust everything back into or near spec? Also, which brand seems to work well? SPC, Kinetix, Stillen, any others?

As always...thanks G Drivers!

G's up...

 

http://www.g35frenzy.com/forum/showt...4410#post14410

here is a link o what i posted on another forum. tryin to get someone to answer. i know there are people out there that have the stuff and info. hopefully they will respond sometime soon.

 

The most thorough suspsension descriptions I've seen come from GSedan35.

Maybe you could PM him and ask him to respond to your post?

I'm like you, I'm a bit confused on what all the options are and what I'll need to get my car in alignment with lowering springs.

 

For the fronts, you'll need an adjustable upper A arm. On the rears, typically people just get the adjustable upper arms and the adjustable toe arms if they want. Considering on the G, we have a multi link suspension, it wouldn't hurt to get the rear upper and toe arms at the same time. At least that way, you can get all the adjustments within spec. After looking at the different camber kits, I like the 350evo and Cusco for the front upper A Arm. For the rears, pretty much all of them are the same.

 

Do not adjust rear toe with traction arms/toe arms. I was just in the middle of doing a full blown post listing all our option's, the do's and don't's and the page went "poof", or should I say a hour and a half's work went by by,.......grrrrr. It'll have to wait until tomarrow.

 

hey guys check out these threads. i just went and did it all yesterday.

rear camber and toe arms
front upper control arms

 

Kinetix front A-arms and the SPC rear camber arms/toe bolts combo should be adequate for any and all camber/toe adjustments you need to make (most economical of what's available - can get everything for around $500) - but do you REALLY need them? How low are you planning on going (ie what suspension setup are you going with)?

...and whatever Gsedan35 says goes, because he is definitely the resident expert when it comes to anything suspension-wise... quick - what's the spring rates of the RS*R Spring for the 350Z?

 

anything below a 2" drop and you should get the SPC Toe Bolts, some kind of adjustable camber arm (stillen, kinetix, spc etc etc) for the rear. The Toe Bolts are the big thing, a bit of a pain to install, but well worth the adjustability.

for the front you will need an adjustable control arm.. kinetix is probably the cheapest, but the 350evo pieces are the most well crafted (however they won't adjust as much as the kinetix pieces). this is based on personal experience.

i am lowered about 3" with kinetix full camber kit (a-arms, toe rods, camber rods and spc toe bolts) and i am within all camber specs.

 

hey turbo...how come you got the toe bolts AND the toe rods? you probably brought it in the package right...but we dont need both the bolts and the toe rod right?

 

Ok, let’s try this again. This whole thing is on a word file, if I need to post this data again, it’ll only be a couple of clicks away for me.

There are 5 camps concerning lowering and alignment.

1. I have to stay within oem camber specs for my sedan or coupe and I might want the most tame settings within those specs.

2. I’m willing to use the more aggressive specs of another G or Z model. A sedan aligned to coupe or even 350Z specs or a coupe aligned to 350Z specs.

3. I’m willing to use option two and a bit beyond, I just can’t see spending all that money on aftermarket camber and toe fixes. Or, I can live with the front being off a bit, since the rear doesn’t cost as much, that’s the end of the car I’d bring within spec.

4. I want a performance alignment.

5. Owners that have a drop that normally does require aftermarket alignment fixes that have never actually had their cars aligned proclaiming that you won’t need a fix or you don‘t need to worry about being within oem specs.

Front camber correction:
Several companies make adjustable front upper control arms that are able to adjust out some degree of negative camber. When the EVO350 and PerformanceNissan arms first hit the market, a few excellent threads on my350z.com cropped up that got directly to the core of both products. Unfortunately, I can’t pull up any thread on that board older then 7/04. But I do remember that based on the discussion’s, IMO the EVO350 arms are the best. However, if your needs are met with the Cusco arms and they don’t turn out to be too much heavier then the oem arms, I could see picking them to control costs.

$849 Stillen front upper control arms
http://www.stillen.com/Sportscars_de...d=43317&page=1

$807 Evo350 front upper control arms
http://www.350evo.com/catalog/produc...a4cdf5bdbf356d

$799 PerformanceNissan front upper control arms
{update 6/18/06, no longer in production sad to say}

$389 Cusco front upper control arms
http://www.z1auto.com/prodmore.asp?m...ng&prodid=1288

$369 Kinetix front upper control arms
http://www.kinetixracing.com/index.a...&ProdID=7&HS=1

$500? SPL
http://www.splparts.com/Parts/Z33/Su...nk/default.asp

Front toe correction:
Thankfully we have a oem adjustment system that doesn’t require any kind of aftermarket fix.


Rear camber correction:
If you require more camber correction then you can get with the oem adjustment system, these arms are the way to do it. The product’s do differ in price, weight and if they use rubber, poly or spherical bearings.

$??? EVO350 These arms are equipped with spherical bearings instead of poly or rubber bushings, though their web site does not show them as a separate part, you don’t have to buy them in a kit with other arms.



$??? Hotchkis rear camber arms. Listed on their web site, but no price is shown. They look like they use a copy of the oem soft rubber bushing, what they actually use for bushings in unknown however.
http://www.hotchkistuning.com/cgi-bi...atalogno=13413
{update 6/18/06 originally planned for production, but never produced}

$175 (estimated price) Top Speed. If this price holds true, these will be the least expensive camber arms out that use spherical bearings instead of poly or rubber bushings. I’m considering getting a set just to have spherical bushings in that location of the suspension even though I don’t really need their added camber correction at this time.
http://350zmotoring.com/forums/showt...5&pagenumber=1
{update 6/18/06, can be had on ebay for as little $79 run a search on ebay under 350z arm}

$440 Jic rear camber arms. Can come with spherical bearings or hard rubber bushings
http://www.streetsports.com/Photos/V...camberarms.jpg

$448 Stillen rear camber arms with “hemispherical rod-ends” instead of poly or rubber bushings
http://www.stillen.com/Sportscars_de...d=43116&page=1

$250 SPC rear camber arms. Bushing material unknown, but they come with a pair of toe cam bolts to adjust our toe (the bolts can be purchased separately).{update 6/18/06 you need two kit's for to do both sides of the car, Nopi online has them for $70 per side}

Rear Toe:
Unlike the front toe adjustment system, as you dial out more and more negitive camber, you also move your rear toe settings in the WRONG direction, less and less toe with more and more camber correction. This is why there is a tie in to correcting your rear camber with aftermarket camber arms and the requirement to also get aftermarket toe control fixes.

Rear toe arms/traction arms should not be used as a method to correct or effect rear toe, don’t worry I’ll get to what you should use to adjust rear toe latter. Toe arms or traction arms are actually the radius rod on these cars. These rods do not adjust toe. Due to their mounting point they cannot adjust toe WITHOUT affecting the caster of the rear spindle. The radius rod attaches to the spindle right on the pivot point between the upper and lower ball joints. It does not attach in front of the pivot point like some believe. Lengthening or shortening of this rod only changes the caster of the spindle because the rod is below the rear axle. So, lengthen the rod and the less caster you get.... Shorten it and you get more caster. Sure... some say that they have lengthened it and it adjusted toe. That is only because the caster has changed so much that the pivot point between upper and lower ball joints has been relocated..... due to the traction rod not being mounted perfectly centered between the upper and lower ball joints the entire rear geometry gets changed to the point that toe was affected. This is the WRONG way to adjust your toe. I would call this a static toe adjustment. This may work as long as your rear suspension never moves.

He’s a second opinion on why not to adjust rear toe with toe arms/traction arms, this is a cut and paste with the understanding that this person calls the radius rod a “rear trailing arm”.
“The rear trailing arms should not be adjustable in length as some companies are selling them as such. They are claiming this as a way to change the toe. While it does change toe statically...it is not the proper way to do so. Changing the length of this arm puts even more load on the rear hub....this results in "bump steer" or toes the rear wheel out during compression.” BJ Zacharias EVO350

Side note on the whole above topic of toe arms/traction arms. Two companies offer fixed arms that should be considered because they use spherical bushings in place of the oem suspension’s use of soft rubber bushings. 350EVO (they call them lower trailing arms) and Jic www.intensepower.com/jicmaretrrod.html

Rear Toe should be adjusted in the same spot where the oem factory system adjusts from, the rear lower link (as the service Manuel calls it). To get more toe adjustment out of the oem adjustment system, buy SPC’s toe cam bolts. They work by having a larger offset washer then the oem toe cam bolts.
http://iapdirect.com/item.asp?invid=785

How to for installing the spc kit
http://www.my350z.com/forum/showthread.php?t=185737

 

very helpful info gsedan!!! thanx!

 

Perfect. I was afraid I had made the wrong choice by going with SPC for the rears. Thanks a lot

 

G,

Just from my personal experience...

I have an '03 sedan which I lowered with the HKS Hipermax LS coilovers. I then had an alignment done and the rear was within spec, but the front had a little negative camber (sorry I don't have access to the exact amount of neg. camber right now). I then purchased a set of the Kinetix A-arms, but I wasn't really impressed with the quality or workmanship of them. Also they looked like they were a pain to adjust, although I never installed them, so I eneded up selling them. I guess you get what you pay for. I now plan to buy either the 350EVO or Stillen A-arms. They both look very well crafted, but I'm leaning towards the 350EVO set for now. I hope this helps.