Grounding Wire Placement
Originally Posted by SixFive
Your putting up alternative arguments only flys if you get off the couch.
Where in the, "physical world", can I figure out how to get it past your fat titanium lined head that the grounding kit is not for ponies. Is there not a better thread for you to stir up your little fantasy of knowing everything whether you tried it or even understand why people use it...duh...becasue you are the Highlander or something- this thread is so last week...
Free exchange of ideas?
Originally Posted by MechEE
Hmmm. I built my own turbo kit, installed it along with a bottom end, cams clutch, etc, cracked the ECU and tuned it myself, AND on top of that all I actually have an understanding for how the physical world works. Bonus! What have you done on cars again? Oh yeah, had some ground wires installed. I'm happy for you. I think I am at least partially justified in giving opinions on items that directly relate to my field of expertise. I'm not in love with any stance, so I'm happy to hear any logical argument you have against my opinion. But you're going to have to do better than "I can feel it, I really can". If I told you the TypeR badge made my car faster, you'd refuse to believe it until I could explain how, even if I showed you dyno evidence. This is the same way I feel about many of these IMO snake-oil-class mods.
This is one of the quotes from it:
Originally Posted by Gordgee
Way back, when the 'kits' were just 5 wires (how it all got started on the G35 and 350Z), virtually all noticed a significant change in smoothness and throttle response. It was with the further development of the extra wires that other benefits were noticed, as well as a noticeable increase in the effects of the basic Systems. The real surprise was the significant improvement found on the 5AT in terms of tranny response, so in effect, the 5AT drivers got a sort of 'double whammy' benefit from the same mod.
The basic effects are still noticed on those with 6MTs, as they are on the numerous vehicles for which GroundingGear Systems have been developed and tested. Some, also get the AT improvements as well, including with the 7wire System developed for the IS300.
I remember when the Magazines were getting 4 to 14hp from this mod (I wish!
), many did it as a power mod. Frankly, I was only able to consistently demonstrate about 4 or 5 hp on repeated dyno analysis, but I doubt that my butt dyno would feel that difference. The better throttle response and smoothness was immediately noticeable however and translated to better drivablility. This is what I had hoped you'd notice.
as I said, I appreciate your feedback.
The basic effects are still noticed on those with 6MTs, as they are on the numerous vehicles for which GroundingGear Systems have been developed and tested. Some, also get the AT improvements as well, including with the 7wire System developed for the IS300.
I remember when the Magazines were getting 4 to 14hp from this mod (I wish!
), many did it as a power mod. Frankly, I was only able to consistently demonstrate about 4 or 5 hp on repeated dyno analysis, but I doubt that my butt dyno would feel that difference. The better throttle response and smoothness was immediately noticeable however and translated to better drivablility. This is what I had hoped you'd notice. as I said, I appreciate your feedback.
I would have thought that a scientist such as your self would not have such "set in stone" opinions. 
Originally Posted by Texasscout
You might want to read this thread: https://g35driver.com/forums/showthr...C+Dyno+results
This is one of the quotes from it:
I do think you are not keeping an open mind about this. I would have thought that a scientist such as your self would not have such "set in stone" opinions.
This is one of the quotes from it:
I do think you are not keeping an open mind about this.
I would have thought that a scientist such as your self would not have such "set in stone" opinions. Trannies shifting faster and smoother and throttle response improving based on replacing the ground system just doesn't make any intuitive sense to me. But present some good scientific evidence for it besides "I can feel it" and I'm open to the possibility. Given all the skeptics out there, I'm just surprised that none of the grounding wire manufacturers have done this. Or am I?
The problem is that the car "feeling better" isn't something that one can easily measure before and after to reproduce.
Originally Posted by MechEE
The problem is that the car "feeling better" isn't something that one can easily measure before and after to reproduce. It's subjective and very susceptible to placebo. However now with high data-rate loggers like Cipher we can attempt to start. Think throttle response is better? Okay, let's log throttle angle / MAF rate / injection durations / timing before and after the wire install. Think it shifts faster and smoother? Okay, let's log vehicle speed versus time (and an accelerometer would be ideal) and go through some shifts before and after and measure the difference in peak accelerations during shift (smoothness) and dead time.
Trannies shifting faster and smoother and throttle response improving based on replacing the ground system just doesn't make any intuitive sense to me. But present some good scientific evidence for it besides "I can feel it" and I'm open to the possibility. Given all the skeptics out there, I'm just surprised that none of the grounding wire manufacturers have done this. Or am I?
Trannies shifting faster and smoother and throttle response improving based on replacing the ground system just doesn't make any intuitive sense to me. But present some good scientific evidence for it besides "I can feel it" and I'm open to the possibility. Given all the skeptics out there, I'm just surprised that none of the grounding wire manufacturers have done this. Or am I?
Originally Posted by Turbo Magazine
Grounding kits first started to make waves in the sport compact scene in 2002. Poorly designed factory grounding systems on some vehicles have allowed for significant power gains when an aftermarket grounding system was installed at key points on the chassis and engine. On the Nissan 350z, for example, we have seen gains as high as eight horsepower to the wheels with just the addition of a grounding system. <snip>
Although it still perplexes us how a grounding system is able to generate horsepower, we won't argue with the dyno sheet.
Although it still perplexes us how a grounding system is able to generate horsepower, we won't argue with the dyno sheet.
Last edited by Texasscout; Feb 6, 2006 at 08:36 AM.
Even Turbo Magazine recognizes that if they can't explain something that doesn't mean it's not happening. Munchee would have surely cast stones at Galileo and most certainly would have called anyone not buying into the round earth theories of the time a sucker. Book Smarts < Experience
Originally Posted by DaveB
I still contend that grounding wires did absolutely nothing for my 03 5AT.
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Joined: May 2005
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From: Charleston, SC
Dude, it's funny how you're so eager to dismiss someone's claim to gaining something from grounding wires, or whatever it is you're being sceptical about at the time, yet you're very quick to embrace someone's claim that it did nothing. If you're truely going to be objective (which you're not) you can't take either one's claim and must solely base your comments on the scientific facts you claim to be seeking.
He obviously fit into that camp of having spent 10's of thousands on mods for a turbo integra or maxima or something and it probably never was worth it and so now he's got the old axe out and he's grinding away. He'll save the world by defaulting to skepticism. Does it seem that most who have gone FI only do it once and they seem to have issues afterwards?
Originally Posted by S.E.
maybe mech got tricked into buying a $500 dollar set of grounding wires and they didnt work. i kid, i kid. yeah i want to buy gordgees 10-wire kit just to improve shifting on my 5AT. if i get ponies too, great, if i dont whatever. its like 150 bucks. if i get it, it doesnt work, i am sure he will refund or work something out....i think its weird you have such an axe togrind agaisnt such a inexpensive mod and its worth. why not find a mod that i might spend like 5 grand on and figure out of it works or not? that would help me out more
