Correct. Part of the reason for the death of the 300 along with other competitors was the market at that time went dead too.

Improvements on the Z must not be done moving the car price into another stratosphere. That's why in some respects rumours of a smaller Z make some sense. I don't know how much smaller the car can get and still be comfortable however. You're probably better able to answer that. On the other hand we hear there is to be a smaller lighter entry level Nissan sport Coupe???

It will certainly be interesting to see what the price range for the GTR. One thing I am quite certain of it's more than I'm willing to put into a car.

 

Correct, but you're going off-topic there.

Time will only tell...

As for now, the only realistic direct competitors I see to the 350Z is the S2000, Mustang GT, RX-8... you know, the cars most people cross shop with.

I think Nissan has its bars set too high if they believe they can create a successful competitor with the Cayman & Z4M if its just the typical "370Z". If anything, they are going to need to spend alot more time on the base Z to bring it up to Porsche & BMW standards.

I just can't imagine the general population cross shopping a Nissan Z, with a Cayman & Z4M unless they're car enthusiats like us; and how many of the general population are car enthusiasts? A very small percentage.

The 370Z will be an excellent car; no doubt about that. I really expect Nissan to score big just as they did with the Z33. I have always been a fan of the Z line-ups, especially the 300ZX & 350Z.

Remember, you're seeing this in the view of an enthusiast. Look at it from the perspective of a typical American/Canadian buyer and think about the Z being a "competitor" to the Cayman & Z4M.

As of now:

Base 2007 350Z: $27,900
Base 2007 Cayman/S: $49,400/59,100
Base 2007 Z4M: $50,100

I think its safe to say the BMW & Porsche are almost twice as expesive. The most I expect the next Z to be priced at will probably be at most $1,000 more than the 350Z, if the current Nissan trend continues (speculation...although it only makes sense).

I'm sure you know this, but the E46 M3 to the E92 M3 will jump almost 10k in price fron the last generation. If the same applies to the next Z4M, the gap becomes even greater.

.

 

LOL, first time I've heard correcting a false statement and some grammar as being off topic.

You're hung up on defining the current competition and the current levels of those cars. All we're talking about is Nissan possibly producing a car with performance standards aimed at the mentioned cars. No one but you is arguing the RX8, S2000 etc wouldn't be cross shopped cars when looking at a Z. I also haven't said a Z customer would necessarily cross shop a Z4M or Cayman, although in my case that's quite possible in the future

I think it's safe to say many people buying either a Cayman, Z or Z4M would be considered enthusiasts. Maybe not by your standards but certainly more so than the general population. Certainly where I live where all of these cars are almost non existent. I think you missed my specific point about comparing a comparably equipped Z (not a base as you keep saying, which we can't even buy in Canada) to the other cars in your price comparison. Otherwise you're really exaggerating the gap between the cars. Relatively comparably equipped is the way a "typical consumer" would do it. Much of the difference we're discussing can be explained by price differentials between the countries. Our frame of references are probably different. A Z isn't a "cheap" base car here. Here in Canada:

350Z GT M6 49,800 (Roadster is 56K)
Cayman/Cayman S 73,000; 85,000 estimate. (I can't seem to get into the Porsche Canada site although have a pretty good idea)
Z4 / Z4M 60,900 ; 68,900

In any case in Canada no where near twice the price.

It's very possible there will not be a next Z4M which a lot of the guys on the bimmer boards are discussing. The sales have been extremely poor. The new M3 is clearly moving upstream. A V8 400+ motor and lots of technology puts it in a different league.

I'm not banking that the next Z will beat the Cayman or the Z4M. Furthermore we don't know if it will be a 370Z as you're referring to it by. I do think it's smart to aim the bar at that level though. It's really not that far away if you start doing some research on power, handling, 1/4 mile, the ring etc. Anything less won't move the car forward much at all against current comparably priced competition. That's especially true with the expected long product cycle of the Z. And you know the competition's not standing still either. As I said before if it can be close at much less cost, that's good enough for me. If it's 3 years away a lot will change between now and then however. By then running with a Cayman S won't be as big a deal either.

Peace brother.

 

Regarding prices: I think its useless for us to continue this talk since we're basically switching from American prices to Canadian. I've noticed that the 350Z in Canada is inflated in comparison to the American prices of the Z vs the Z4M/Cayman.

Also, we live in completely different environments; many of the cars you would expect to be driven by enthusiasts are just driven by people with too much money here in Los Angeles. (I've met an M3 owner who told me they chose an M3 over a 330i just for bragging rights ).

As far as everything else, I will wait those few years until I hear official words. I got a little hung over in speculation, even though I said I wouldn't.

As of now... Peace

.

 

Seems us Z enthusiasts won't see a change until the 2011 model... But some good news to those who like the Z as is, Nismo is releasing two models, the Nismo 350z which is just cosmetic and suspension/exhaust upgrades and a Nismo 380z which has the same changes but with 350hp.

Not sure I could bring myself to spend $48k on a 350hp Z.... but u do get a standard warranty with it

 

Yes, I agree on the price issue. Most cars in Canada are hugely inflated. I paid 49k plus 15% tax for my '04 coupe 6mt. I live in an area that's nothing like SoCal. Probably closer to west virginia in lifestyle. Even a half decent car tends to stand out.

Yeah, I've noticed that before you say you don't want to speculate but get caught up in all the banter. I can relate. A lot of the fun is talking and thinking about them before they actually get here.

 

You mean Hara-Kiri? Hari kara means "from the stomach(?)."

 

Oh snap, that post was made in 2006!

 

There are alot more than just suspension, and cosmetic. Lots of structural reinforcements like Seam welds especially. :P I own one and its a huge difference from the normal Z.

 

^^lol

 

i read an article that a new one was coming out called "450z"

 

 

boo... no proof of restyled Z yet.. too busy working on GT-R

 

That's the new model with the 4.5L V8 "twincharged" engine, i.e., it has both a supercharger and a turbocharger, like the Euro-spec 1.4L Golf has. It will have 820bhp, with be tri-fuel capable (gas, hydrogen, methane from cow farts), and will be weight reduced to 800 lbs., giving it a 0-60 time of -1.5 seconds (yes, it will be so fast, it will warp time).

Seriously though... you'll likely see the 3.7L VQ from the G37 in the next Z. Nissan won't put a V8 in the Z and cannibalize GT-R sales.

 

haha I thought "is he fvcking serious" on that first paragraph.
btw double post FTL