Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
#1
07-06-2004, 12:09 AM
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Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
I've been thinking about my G for some time now. Specifically, did I buy a luxury status car of the same breeding as a Mercedes, BMW, Cadillac, Lexus, Acura, and Jaguar...? Or did I buy a really well made sedan that performs as well as similar sedans made by these brands but which in reality lacks the luxury pedigree?
It seems that a lot of cars are marketed as luxury cars. But what makes a car stand out in the minds of buyers and the public as a true luxury brand?
If the BMW 3 series is inferior to the G35 but still sells for thousands of dollars more – what accounts for this? Are the BMW owners’ in fact getting their money’s worth because they’ve bought status with the luxury branding that BMW offers?
It’s not that I really care if my car has a luxury car pedigree – it’s just that I’m wondering if I paid too much because the Infiniti division of Nissan is selling it as a “luxury” car. If it’s not a luxury car on the same level as a BMW (and the pricing of the cars seems to support this) than why couldn’t I get it from the Nissan dealership? From what I can tell I would have paid less upfront and I’d be paying less for parts and service. (I support this conclusion from the simple observation that there are a great many more Nissan dealerships than Infiniti dealerships and that means competition and lower prices.)
So, what do you think? Do we pay too much for our G’s because Nissan sells it as an Infiniti?
04 G35X
It seems that a lot of cars are marketed as luxury cars. But what makes a car stand out in the minds of buyers and the public as a true luxury brand?
If the BMW 3 series is inferior to the G35 but still sells for thousands of dollars more – what accounts for this? Are the BMW owners’ in fact getting their money’s worth because they’ve bought status with the luxury branding that BMW offers?
It’s not that I really care if my car has a luxury car pedigree – it’s just that I’m wondering if I paid too much because the Infiniti division of Nissan is selling it as a “luxury” car. If it’s not a luxury car on the same level as a BMW (and the pricing of the cars seems to support this) than why couldn’t I get it from the Nissan dealership? From what I can tell I would have paid less upfront and I’d be paying less for parts and service. (I support this conclusion from the simple observation that there are a great many more Nissan dealerships than Infiniti dealerships and that means competition and lower prices.)
So, what do you think? Do we pay too much for our G’s because Nissan sells it as an Infiniti?
04 G35X
#2
07-06-2004, 12:49 AM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
Ppl actually stop to talk to me about my G35 quite frequently. Most seem to believe that the G35 is priced quite a bit higher than they are since it's an "Infiniti", and are quite surprised when I tell them the price. Of course, this is in Canada, so I'm not sure about experiences and attitudes in the US.
After having my car for over 2 years, I notice on the street that it still gets admiring looks, even parked in restaurant lots that have BMWs and Benz's in them. Definitely seems to have more status than the Acuras IMO.
<font color=blue>[i]GroundingGear™ Equipped </font color=blue>
After having my car for over 2 years, I notice on the street that it still gets admiring looks, even parked in restaurant lots that have BMWs and Benz's in them. Definitely seems to have more status than the Acuras IMO.
<font color=blue>[i]GroundingGear™ Equipped </font color=blue>
#3
07-06-2004, 01:53 AM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
I've had each of those luxo brands you've mentioned parked in my garage at one point or another, except the Acura... I'd have to say that Infiniti is making their name known more and more in the luxury market, but aren't at the bimmer/merc status because they're Japanese.
It's all perception-- but I can tell you that no, the BMW owners didn't get their money's worth in "brand", because every time you buy "brand" you are throwing away money. If anything, they lost total value in the deal because of it. Still great cars, though.
G
2003.5 Black w/ Willow G35
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It's all perception-- but I can tell you that no, the BMW owners didn't get their money's worth in "brand", because every time you buy "brand" you are throwing away money. If anything, they lost total value in the deal because of it. Still great cars, though.
G
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<font color=blue>Z-tube, Pop-charger, Borla True-Dual Exhaust, Eibach Pro Kit, GroundingGear</font color=blue>
#4
07-06-2004, 04:06 AM
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Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
If you live in SoCal or have visited SoCal recently, u will see tons of G35s on the street. although not as many as the BMW 3, but should be more than the MB- c class, and no doubt much more than Audi A4s; according to my observation. At the 30~36K range, G35 is really hard to beat in terms of performance and over-all package. please give some more time to let infiniti to improve it's quality. anyway, FX35 and the coming M concept clearly states that infinti is trying hard to improve.
#5
07-06-2004, 09:59 AM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
Ever since the Infiniti and Lexus brands were introduced into the U.S., they have been head-to-head with each other (with Lexus clearly beating out Infiniti up to the past year or two) and especially in the past 8 years or so, they have been solidly competing with BMW, Mercedes, and Audi. This is according to all the car mags, JD Powers rankings, etc. If you include Audi, all 5 luxury brand car mfgr's are perceived as such...the luxury brands with a wide range of luxury vehicles -- family sedans, sport sedans, coupes, convertibles, wagons, and now SUV's and CrossOvers. (Note - I excluded Jaguar, although definitely considered a luxury brand, it's still more of a niche brand which doesn't have the wide ranging vehicle lineup as the others. Volvo (now owned by Ford) and Acura (Honda) are regarded as luxury or near luxury brands, but don't always go head-to-head with the others. In addition, Cadillac is perceived as a top American luxury brand, but because it's a GM brand, it's suffered from lower quality build and materials (when compared to the Japanese and German luxury brands); however, it too has made a hard push to change that image and increase it's perceived quality).
BMW and MB have always been higher in price, probably for many reasons, but mainly, just because they can get people to fork over more $$. In fact, most will say that MB's quality has seriously decreased in recent years, and although BMW still remains at the top, the truth is that the Japanese (i.e. Lexus and Infiniti) seem to offer high quality and high performance for less $$...more bang for the buck! The other thing is that the luxury mfgr's are being swallowed up by the larger car mfgr's -- e.g. Volvo - Ford, Jaguar - Ford, MB - Daimler Chryler, Saab - GM, etc. so many share parts and platforms...it's getting more difficult to distinguish one brand/car from the other.
All these mfgr's including Infiniti are priced competitively with each other, with MB and BMW averaging higher in price (probably just because they can get it and they typically nickel-and-dime the consumer -- e.g. - std. "leatherette" on many MB). Many will argue that BMW or Lexus may be the highest in quality, with MB being 2nd (although JD Powers may disagree ;-), and Infiniti and Audi are perceived a bit lower. Nonetheless, the Infiniti Q flagship has always been compared to the Lexus LS flagship, which are comapared to the MB S Class and the BMW 7 Series. Same goes for the mid-range and entry-level sport sedans, coupes, convertibles, and the SUVs.
So, in the end, most people perceive the Infiniti brand (especially in the past few years with new, innovative designs and technology) as one of the top luxury brands and they forget that it's made by Nissan (just like most people forget that Lexus is made by Toyota ;-)...and yes, it's a status thing too. Most people would prefer to drive a Lexus or Infiniti over a Toyota or Nissan. Personally, I have always been more impressed by the quality, comfort, safety, features, performance, service, and value of Lexus more so than any of the other luxury brands (I owned 3 of them previously), but now, Infiniti has won us over for the time being...we now have 2 Infiniti's -- an '04.5 G35 (although it's my co. car) and an '03 FX35 with Prem, Sport, and Tech packages (our family car). It appears as if Nissan/Infiniti has made a very hard and successful push to improve their vehicles; I hope they continue. I'm sure Lexus will respond accordingly...if anything, it will be interesting to see this fight and we, the consumers will benefit from it ;-)
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small"><EM>Edited by bsgoren on 07/06/04 11:06 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
BMW and MB have always been higher in price, probably for many reasons, but mainly, just because they can get people to fork over more $$. In fact, most will say that MB's quality has seriously decreased in recent years, and although BMW still remains at the top, the truth is that the Japanese (i.e. Lexus and Infiniti) seem to offer high quality and high performance for less $$...more bang for the buck! The other thing is that the luxury mfgr's are being swallowed up by the larger car mfgr's -- e.g. Volvo - Ford, Jaguar - Ford, MB - Daimler Chryler, Saab - GM, etc. so many share parts and platforms...it's getting more difficult to distinguish one brand/car from the other.
All these mfgr's including Infiniti are priced competitively with each other, with MB and BMW averaging higher in price (probably just because they can get it and they typically nickel-and-dime the consumer -- e.g. - std. "leatherette" on many MB). Many will argue that BMW or Lexus may be the highest in quality, with MB being 2nd (although JD Powers may disagree ;-), and Infiniti and Audi are perceived a bit lower. Nonetheless, the Infiniti Q flagship has always been compared to the Lexus LS flagship, which are comapared to the MB S Class and the BMW 7 Series. Same goes for the mid-range and entry-level sport sedans, coupes, convertibles, and the SUVs.
So, in the end, most people perceive the Infiniti brand (especially in the past few years with new, innovative designs and technology) as one of the top luxury brands and they forget that it's made by Nissan (just like most people forget that Lexus is made by Toyota ;-)...and yes, it's a status thing too. Most people would prefer to drive a Lexus or Infiniti over a Toyota or Nissan. Personally, I have always been more impressed by the quality, comfort, safety, features, performance, service, and value of Lexus more so than any of the other luxury brands (I owned 3 of them previously), but now, Infiniti has won us over for the time being...we now have 2 Infiniti's -- an '04.5 G35 (although it's my co. car) and an '03 FX35 with Prem, Sport, and Tech packages (our family car). It appears as if Nissan/Infiniti has made a very hard and successful push to improve their vehicles; I hope they continue. I'm sure Lexus will respond accordingly...if anything, it will be interesting to see this fight and we, the consumers will benefit from it ;-)
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small"><EM>Edited by bsgoren on 07/06/04 11:06 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
#6
07-06-2004, 10:32 AM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
CaleJohnson:
You make some good points and observations, and have raised some fair questions. Remember, Cale, that the G35 is the entry-level Infiniti, and is actually not considered a luxury car, instead being considered a "near" luxury car by the magazines and reviewers. Also, it's price is very low when considering what you get for the $, and as you so well put it, you've bought "a really well made sedan that performs as well (or better!) as similar sedans made by Mercedes, BMW. Cadillac, Lexus, Acura, and Jaguar". The luxury "pedigree" costs a bit more, but you're in it's "aura" with the entry -level Infiniti. You got all that you paid for and more - did you buy a "luxury" car? - NO, you bought an entry level near luxury car. Remember, a fully loaded Altima costs almost the same as a loaded G35, and a loaded Maxima costs MORE, so it's obvious that the "G" machine is the best compromise of performance, style, value, and luxury that Infiniti can market at this price point. Also, those two cars should serve to illustrate that Nissan probably wouldn't/couldn't market the G35 any cheaper via Nissan dealerships, and again, it would appear that the "G" is priced artificially low to get those new buyers, while Nissan division knows what it has and prices it's products at the limit, having already built the brand loyalty it needed with consumers.
Infiniti intended the G35 to be their lighting rod, to attract all those buyers they couldn't even get to look at their cars previously. They had always concentrated on trying to be a cheaper Mercedes, but Lexus (the Japanese "Mercedes")stole that market with better products (bottom line!), so they got smart and took a different approach, with an emphasis on performance first, and luxury second (i.e., the Japanese "BMW"), and it's working like gangbusters. Until the G35, I'd never seriously considered an Infiniti, and Infiniti's plan is to build brand loyalty with us, then hope we'll move upmarket with them, going M45, FX35/45, and eventually Q45 or full-size SUVs, when we become old farts. Mercedes is doing the same thing now, by "lowering the bar" on their "C" class cars, to get younger buyers into them, then hope they, too, progress on up the Mercedes "ladder" as they mature.
Sure, there are areas where my "G" is lacking, and I won't ever pretend that it is comparable to a Mercedes in terms of luxury, but it commands respect with the Infinit name, and it more than backs it up on the open road. I'm happy, but I don't kid myself into thinking that I am in the realm of cars costing 30%-50% more, either. As a sidelight, I have had VERY few people talk to me about my "G" who really knew what they sell for, always guessing $10,000 more than I paid - so some of the "aura" is definitely transferring to this car.
My $0.02.
Sport Sedan Fan - 2004 6MT Sedan
Sport/Navigation/Premium/Aero; "Invisiguard" Bra, Madico Onyx Tint
Obsidian Black/Graphite & "Titanium"
SHE'S SILVER & BLACK - GO RAIDERS!
You make some good points and observations, and have raised some fair questions. Remember, Cale, that the G35 is the entry-level Infiniti, and is actually not considered a luxury car, instead being considered a "near" luxury car by the magazines and reviewers. Also, it's price is very low when considering what you get for the $, and as you so well put it, you've bought "a really well made sedan that performs as well (or better!) as similar sedans made by Mercedes, BMW. Cadillac, Lexus, Acura, and Jaguar". The luxury "pedigree" costs a bit more, but you're in it's "aura" with the entry -level Infiniti. You got all that you paid for and more - did you buy a "luxury" car? - NO, you bought an entry level near luxury car. Remember, a fully loaded Altima costs almost the same as a loaded G35, and a loaded Maxima costs MORE, so it's obvious that the "G" machine is the best compromise of performance, style, value, and luxury that Infiniti can market at this price point. Also, those two cars should serve to illustrate that Nissan probably wouldn't/couldn't market the G35 any cheaper via Nissan dealerships, and again, it would appear that the "G" is priced artificially low to get those new buyers, while Nissan division knows what it has and prices it's products at the limit, having already built the brand loyalty it needed with consumers.
Infiniti intended the G35 to be their lighting rod, to attract all those buyers they couldn't even get to look at their cars previously. They had always concentrated on trying to be a cheaper Mercedes, but Lexus (the Japanese "Mercedes")stole that market with better products (bottom line!), so they got smart and took a different approach, with an emphasis on performance first, and luxury second (i.e., the Japanese "BMW"), and it's working like gangbusters. Until the G35, I'd never seriously considered an Infiniti, and Infiniti's plan is to build brand loyalty with us, then hope we'll move upmarket with them, going M45, FX35/45, and eventually Q45 or full-size SUVs, when we become old farts. Mercedes is doing the same thing now, by "lowering the bar" on their "C" class cars, to get younger buyers into them, then hope they, too, progress on up the Mercedes "ladder" as they mature.
Sure, there are areas where my "G" is lacking, and I won't ever pretend that it is comparable to a Mercedes in terms of luxury, but it commands respect with the Infinit name, and it more than backs it up on the open road. I'm happy, but I don't kid myself into thinking that I am in the realm of cars costing 30%-50% more, either. As a sidelight, I have had VERY few people talk to me about my "G" who really knew what they sell for, always guessing $10,000 more than I paid - so some of the "aura" is definitely transferring to this car.
My $0.02.
Sport Sedan Fan - 2004 6MT Sedan
Sport/Navigation/Premium/Aero; "Invisiguard" Bra, Madico Onyx Tint
Obsidian Black/Graphite & "Titanium"
SHE'S SILVER & BLACK - GO RAIDERS!
#7
07-06-2004, 10:53 AM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
Well said, dbarnes. If I continue to enjoy both our Infiniti's and if I don't like something better in a few years (e.g. a new Lexus, BMW, or whatever), I am keeping a close eye on that new Infiniti M45 for my next co. car..he he. ;-)
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter
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#8
07-06-2004, 12:04 PM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>
Volvo (now owned by GM)
<hr></blockquote>
Actually, Volvo is owned by Ford , Saab is GM.
http://www.ford.com/en/default.htm
Damn, a G35 for a company car, nice job!
Brilliant Silver/Graphite/Chrome Wheels '04 Sedan/5AT
Volvo (now owned by GM)
<hr></blockquote>
Actually, Volvo is owned by Ford , Saab is GM.
http://www.ford.com/en/default.htm
Damn, a G35 for a company car, nice job!
Brilliant Silver/Graphite/Chrome Wheels '04 Sedan/5AT
#9
07-06-2004, 12:33 PM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
Ah ha...you are correct. That's what I meant, Saab is owned by GM and Volvo is owned by Ford. It's a crazy world...maybe one day, they'll all be owned by Microsoft. ;-) Thanks.
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small"><EM>Edited by bsgoren on 07/06/04 11:09 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small"><EM>Edited by bsgoren on 07/06/04 11:09 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
#10
07-06-2004, 01:58 PM
#11
07-06-2004, 02:19 PM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
ABQ_G35,
RE: "Damn, a G35 for a company car, nice job!" --
Thanks, I think the G35 is just a wee bit better than the 2000 Ford Taurus (with no ABS brakes) they gave me for almost 4 years ;-). The Taurus was surprisingly a good car though...very reliable and got me from A to B. The G35 is an upgrade, but I'm worth it...now I just get from A to B in more style -- with leather seats, XM Sat Radio, ABS brakes, side-curtain airbags, a Navi system, and I certainly get there a lot quicker ;-)
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small"><EM>Edited by bsgoren on 07/06/04 11:22 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
RE: "Damn, a G35 for a company car, nice job!" --
Thanks, I think the G35 is just a wee bit better than the 2000 Ford Taurus (with no ABS brakes) they gave me for almost 4 years ;-). The Taurus was surprisingly a good car though...very reliable and got me from A to B. The G35 is an upgrade, but I'm worth it...now I just get from A to B in more style -- with leather seats, XM Sat Radio, ABS brakes, side-curtain airbags, a Navi system, and I certainly get there a lot quicker ;-)
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small"><EM>Edited by bsgoren on 07/06/04 11:22 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
#12
07-06-2004, 02:44 PM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
Hey, while we're at it, let's be sure and note that vaunted Jaguar is now really a Ford, and Mercedes is now a Chrysler product (the tail wagging the dog, but you get my point).
So, when people make comments like "Infiniti is just a Nissan, Lexus is just a Toyota", we can counter that EVERYTHING is just a SOMETHING, in this world of ours.
Also, I've always wondered what would have happened had Bill Gates been a gearhead - we'd probably be having MAJOR advances in automobile performance, and writing all of our checks to "Microsoft".
My $0.02.
Sport Sedan Fan - 2004 6MT Sedan
Sport/Navigation/Premium/Aero; "Invisiguard" Bra, Madico Onyx Tint
Obsidian Black/Graphite & "Titanium"
SHE'S SILVER & BLACK - GO RAIDERS!
So, when people make comments like "Infiniti is just a Nissan, Lexus is just a Toyota", we can counter that EVERYTHING is just a SOMETHING, in this world of ours.
Also, I've always wondered what would have happened had Bill Gates been a gearhead - we'd probably be having MAJOR advances in automobile performance, and writing all of our checks to "Microsoft".
My $0.02.
Sport Sedan Fan - 2004 6MT Sedan
Sport/Navigation/Premium/Aero; "Invisiguard" Bra, Madico Onyx Tint
Obsidian Black/Graphite & "Titanium"
SHE'S SILVER & BLACK - GO RAIDERS!
#13
07-06-2004, 03:07 PM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
I mentioned that about Jag and MB; it's funny too, beacuse I still hear about Jags, BMWs, and Mercedes always being in the shop for problems. They may be top luxury brands, but they're far from perfect. I can't tell you just how many times my brother's MB S430 has been in for service problems (some major too) and my other bro's BMW 530i also has been in many times for problems. They've driven so many loaner cars, sometimes they forget which one is really theirs ;-). Just about all I ever done (excluding a few minor issues) to my Lexus' and Infiniti's is change the oil/filter and rotate the tires!!!
This is one of the main reasons I have always steered away from these other lux brands...again, I hate to say it, but the Japanese are very good at making high quality cars (and they're typically very reliable). The Germans make great cars, but they're still a bit finicky, and well, those Jags, just drip "luxury" from every crevass, but they've always had a history of problems (maybe they drip oil and other fluids too ;-); not sure if Ford will fix that or not...FORD -- Fix Or Repaired Daily...ha ha. In all seriousness, I think Ford still has better quality than GM (although the 'New' Cadillac is getting better...more German-like engineering and quality). For now, I'll stick with what works best for me!
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small"><EM>Edited by bsgoren on 07/06/04 12:09 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
This is one of the main reasons I have always steered away from these other lux brands...again, I hate to say it, but the Japanese are very good at making high quality cars (and they're typically very reliable). The Germans make great cars, but they're still a bit finicky, and well, those Jags, just drip "luxury" from every crevass, but they've always had a history of problems (maybe they drip oil and other fluids too ;-); not sure if Ford will fix that or not...FORD -- Fix Or Repaired Daily...ha ha. In all seriousness, I think Ford still has better quality than GM (although the 'New' Cadillac is getting better...more German-like engineering and quality). For now, I'll stick with what works best for me!
2004.5 G35-S 5AT Black/Willow - Prem, R. Spoiler, Navi, Infiniti Sport Wheels, Alum Pedals, Dark Tint, Z Tube, K&N Filter<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small"><EM>Edited by bsgoren on 07/06/04 12:09 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
#14
07-06-2004, 06:34 PM
Re: Am I Getting Luxury Car Status?
I know that, when I was looking at cars, the GS300 was pretty nice, with a quieter ride and a better size than the G35. But it felt underpowered, and I would have had to buy an used one to afford it.
Obviously, it is too early to know what my next car will be. Many people here are raving about the M45, but I tend to keep my vehicles 6-7 years, so that is time for the upcoming M45 to get dated and replaced. And who knows what my budget will be like by then? I might be able to afford an LS, or I may have to settle for keeping the G35 for 10 years instead
Or I might get married, and need a larger vehicle.
2004 Sedan/DVD Navigation/Desert Platinum/Willow
Obviously, it is too early to know what my next car will be. Many people here are raving about the M45, but I tend to keep my vehicles 6-7 years, so that is time for the upcoming M45 to get dated and replaced. And who knows what my budget will be like by then? I might be able to afford an LS, or I may have to settle for keeping the G35 for 10 years instead
Or I might get married, and need a larger vehicle.
2004 Sedan/DVD Navigation/Desert Platinum/Willow
#15
07-06-2004, 06:36 PM