Fundamental exhaust question...
#76
10-06-2006, 11:20 PM
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Originally Posted by ISMSOLUTIONS
SILVERBOLT -
Your the master of assumption - you have no idea what the discussions CLEAN and I have had over the last 2 days with you out of the way...and I didn't apologize either.
I chose to have discussion with him away from the drama king, you, and everything seems to be fine now.
He and i will continue our discussion in private - and as I told him, you are now on my ignore list.
After all - he and I are being very civil to each other now ...
Rick
Your the master of assumption - you have no idea what the discussions CLEAN and I have had over the last 2 days with you out of the way...and I didn't apologize either.
I chose to have discussion with him away from the drama king, you, and everything seems to be fine now.
He and i will continue our discussion in private - and as I told him, you are now on my ignore list.
After all - he and I are being very civil to each other now ...
Rick
#77
10-06-2006, 11:32 PM
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#78
10-08-2006, 03:29 AM
Rick, as always, you have proved your antagonists that they have no reason to disprect you and your knowledge. No offense Silverbolt, I can understand why you would get a little frustrated, but the disrepect and ridicule was totally unncessary. Also, Rick provided way more information than you did. At least if you're going to ridicule someone, add some better information to back yourself up.
Rick, I like your experiments. Maybe you should post up this information up on your website so interested car owners can learn more about the efficiency of various exhaust set ups.
Rick, I like your experiments. Maybe you should post up this information up on your website so interested car owners can learn more about the efficiency of various exhaust set ups.
#79
10-08-2006, 09:25 AM
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#80
10-08-2006, 12:00 PM
Originally Posted by G05C
Rick, as always, you have proved your antagonists that they have no reason to disprect you and your knowledge. No offense Silverbolt, I can understand why you would get a little frustrated, but the disrepect and ridicule was totally unncessary. Also, Rick provided way more information than you did. At least if you're going to ridicule someone, add some better information to back yourself up.
Rick, I like your experiments. Maybe you should post up this information up on your website so interested car owners can learn more about the efficiency of various exhaust set ups.
Rick, I like your experiments. Maybe you should post up this information up on your website so interested car owners can learn more about the efficiency of various exhaust set ups.
By the way, as I've said before, I'm not an employee or paid by Fast Intentions. I know Tony is currently working on revising the site, fixing a few things, and adding lots of content. It will take time, but more informative information, like your asking, is already part to the goal.
Rick
#81
10-08-2006, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by G05C
Rick, as always, you have proved your antagonists that they have no reason to disprect you and your knowledge. No offense Silverbolt, I can understand why you would get a little frustrated, but the disrepect and ridicule was totally unncessary. Also, Rick provided way more information than you did. At least if you're going to ridicule someone, add some better information to back yourself up.
Rick, I like your experiments. Maybe you should post up this information up on your website so interested car owners can learn more about the efficiency of various exhaust set ups.
Rick, I like your experiments. Maybe you should post up this information up on your website so interested car owners can learn more about the efficiency of various exhaust set ups.
Last edited by Silverbolt; 10-08-2006 at 12:28 PM.
#82
10-08-2006, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by ISMSOLUTIONS
Excerpt one:
The bottom line comes to this test I did on my own:
Make a Y pipe out of 1/2" PVC and make an X pipe out PVC as well. They may not be perfect examples of custom cut and welded pipe, but make them, as boxy as they will be - at least they will have the same disadvantages. On the top of the Y pipe - put a 2" piece of PVC with a reducer.
Then take 2 hoses and turn the pressure all the way up on the X pipe you made. You will see how the water flows and/or backs up the pipe. Then do the same with the Y pipe - using BOTH hoses - this is why there is a 2" piece of PVC on top. Now watch how the water flows and backs up.
The efficiency of the X is hugely better. The water will flow very smoothly out the X and there will be far less water backing up the pipe than the Y pipe will show you. You will also notice the Y pipe does not flow nearly as smooth and chokes on itself as well.
Also, if you let the pipe end flow into a bucket filled with water, you will see how many bubbles come of of the end in a Y pipe compared to the X - about 5 times more bubbles. This represents the pockets of air and the pulses not lining up, and being crammed into each other, instead of balanced and re-ordered.
Trust me man - I've done my homework on this, with HUNDREDS of dyno's testing different combinations and bolt-on systems.
I know you want to see more linear data - but manufacturers and R&D teams wont give it to you. I have yet to find it myself - and I've been looking for over a year.
Rick
The bottom line comes to this test I did on my own:
Make a Y pipe out of 1/2" PVC and make an X pipe out PVC as well. They may not be perfect examples of custom cut and welded pipe, but make them, as boxy as they will be - at least they will have the same disadvantages. On the top of the Y pipe - put a 2" piece of PVC with a reducer.
Then take 2 hoses and turn the pressure all the way up on the X pipe you made. You will see how the water flows and/or backs up the pipe. Then do the same with the Y pipe - using BOTH hoses - this is why there is a 2" piece of PVC on top. Now watch how the water flows and backs up.
The efficiency of the X is hugely better. The water will flow very smoothly out the X and there will be far less water backing up the pipe than the Y pipe will show you. You will also notice the Y pipe does not flow nearly as smooth and chokes on itself as well.
Also, if you let the pipe end flow into a bucket filled with water, you will see how many bubbles come of of the end in a Y pipe compared to the X - about 5 times more bubbles. This represents the pockets of air and the pulses not lining up, and being crammed into each other, instead of balanced and re-ordered.
Trust me man - I've done my homework on this, with HUNDREDS of dyno's testing different combinations and bolt-on systems.
I know you want to see more linear data - but manufacturers and R&D teams wont give it to you. I have yet to find it myself - and I've been looking for over a year.
Rick
#83
10-08-2006, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by ISMSOLUTIONS
Sorry man - do a better job of reading at least...give me a break...show enough respect back to at least read the post I put up that YOU asked for.
Rick
Rick
After you FINALLY answered Chris's question, I asked if you can post it on the forum for all members to learn... not for me. You posting it on the forum doesnt benifit me in any way at all, since I could easily walk up to Chris and ask him myself. I gave you credit where credit was due. You finally addressed the question, and I thanked you for that. Now can you please stop acting like a jerk and share with the forum the details?
#84
10-08-2006, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by G05C
Rick, as always, you have proved your antagonists that they have no reason to disprect you and your knowledge. No offense Silverbolt, I can understand why you would get a little frustrated, but the disrepect and ridicule was totally unncessary. Also, Rick provided way more information than you did. At least if you're going to ridicule someone, add some better information to back yourself up.
Rick, I like your experiments. Maybe you should post up this information up on your website so interested car owners can learn more about the efficiency of various exhaust set ups.
Rick, I like your experiments. Maybe you should post up this information up on your website so interested car owners can learn more about the efficiency of various exhaust set ups.
Speaking of whats totally unnecessary. It was unnecessary for Rick to insult Chris (CLEAN) over and over agian, and insult Chris's intellegence, bascially calling him an idiot for not understanding what Rick was saying... when it was actually Rick that was not addressing the quesion. Maybe I over reacted, but I dont take lightly when someone attacks family. If he hasnt appolgized to Chris, then I still think Rick owes Chris an appology for acting like a big headed arrogang jerk.
#85
10-08-2006, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by ISMSOLUTIONS
SILVERBOLT -
Are you going to contribute anything to this thread other than a bad attitude? The rest of us have put that aside...it's your turn. If your going to continue degrading things - I'm outta here...
Rick
Are you going to contribute anything to this thread other than a bad attitude? The rest of us have put that aside...it's your turn. If your going to continue degrading things - I'm outta here...
Rick
Last edited by Silverbolt; 10-08-2006 at 09:12 PM.
#86
10-08-2006, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ISMSOLUTIONS
To address the question of the pipe sizes I used in the experiment:
It was all 1/2" - it was the easiest as I would just slide the hose-ends right into each inlet without worrying about leaking once they back-flowed.
Just as if a custom Y/H or X was being made, I would use all 2 1/2" pipe, cut the pipes as necessary and insert the H, mate the Y or cross the X. I used flexible PVC to best simulate the mandrel bending of the pipes as well, only I made seams in the corners and bends to keep them in the shape I wanted/needed.
The same types of cuts and joining were made, just as they would have been done on actual pipe, to the PCV and then sealed. I wouldn't do it any other way - even on a car. The goal was to simulate flow, though this was water, for an all 2 1/2" exhaust system.
Rick
It was all 1/2" - it was the easiest as I would just slide the hose-ends right into each inlet without worrying about leaking once they back-flowed.
Just as if a custom Y/H or X was being made, I would use all 2 1/2" pipe, cut the pipes as necessary and insert the H, mate the Y or cross the X. I used flexible PVC to best simulate the mandrel bending of the pipes as well, only I made seams in the corners and bends to keep them in the shape I wanted/needed.
The same types of cuts and joining were made, just as they would have been done on actual pipe, to the PCV and then sealed. I wouldn't do it any other way - even on a car. The goal was to simulate flow, though this was water, for an all 2 1/2" exhaust system.
Rick
#87
10-08-2006, 09:56 PM
Sorry all - I'm done here...I'm not going to deal with SILVERBOLT anymore, and don't have to.
SILVERBOLT - Chris can fight his battles..and there isn't a battle for him to fight anymore...so butt out and mind your own business. You seem to want to have fights with me, just because you can't let go of something that has nothing to do with you.
You may think Chris is 'too nice for his own good', and that's something you may want to pay attention to...you can learn from him greatly. Your grudges, especially those that don't belong to you, will come back to haunt you some day.
Anyone else can feel free to PM me if you want info or have questions.
Rick
SILVERBOLT - Chris can fight his battles..and there isn't a battle for him to fight anymore...so butt out and mind your own business. You seem to want to have fights with me, just because you can't let go of something that has nothing to do with you.
You may think Chris is 'too nice for his own good', and that's something you may want to pay attention to...you can learn from him greatly. Your grudges, especially those that don't belong to you, will come back to haunt you some day.
Anyone else can feel free to PM me if you want info or have questions.
Rick
#88
10-09-2006, 03:14 AM
Originally Posted by ISMSOLUTIONS
Sorry all - I'm done here...I'm not going to deal with SILVERBOLT anymore, and don't have to.
SILVERBOLT - Chris can fight his battles..and there isn't a battle for him to fight anymore...so butt out and mind your own business. You seem to want to have fights with me, just because you can't let go of something that has nothing to do with you.
You may think Chris is 'too nice for his own good', and that's something you may want to pay attention to...you can learn from him greatly. Your grudges, especially those that don't belong to you, will come back to haunt you some day.
Anyone else can feel free to PM me if you want info or have questions.
Rick
SILVERBOLT - Chris can fight his battles..and there isn't a battle for him to fight anymore...so butt out and mind your own business. You seem to want to have fights with me, just because you can't let go of something that has nothing to do with you.
You may think Chris is 'too nice for his own good', and that's something you may want to pay attention to...you can learn from him greatly. Your grudges, especially those that don't belong to you, will come back to haunt you some day.
Anyone else can feel free to PM me if you want info or have questions.
Rick
#89
10-09-2006, 03:22 AM
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Originally Posted by G05C
Silverbolt, thanks for ur explanation and reply to my message. However, I think Rick is right when it comes to Chris defending himself. I think you gave yourself a 'higher authority' or 'body-guard type' mentality when he did not ask for it openly. I could be wrong, but from what I have seen, Rick is trying his best to solve questions- people get frustrated once in awhile but I think Chris is mature enough to know when to step up for himself.
#90
10-09-2006, 03:24 AM
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Originally Posted by ISMSOLUTIONS
Sorry all - I'm done here...I'm not going to deal with SILVERBOLT anymore, and don't have to.
SILVERBOLT - Chris can fight his battles..and there isn't a battle for him to fight anymore...so butt out and mind your own business. You seem to want to have fights with me, just because you can't let go of something that has nothing to do with you.
You may think Chris is 'too nice for his own good', and that's something you may want to pay attention to...you can learn from him greatly. Your grudges, especially those that don't belong to you, will come back to haunt you some day.
Anyone else can feel free to PM me if you want info or have questions.
Rick
SILVERBOLT - Chris can fight his battles..and there isn't a battle for him to fight anymore...so butt out and mind your own business. You seem to want to have fights with me, just because you can't let go of something that has nothing to do with you.
You may think Chris is 'too nice for his own good', and that's something you may want to pay attention to...you can learn from him greatly. Your grudges, especially those that don't belong to you, will come back to haunt you some day.
Anyone else can feel free to PM me if you want info or have questions.
Rick