Question to those w/ Vortech Kit
#16
Originally Posted by Hollywood G35
I've owned both. I've replaced my Vortech SC with a Greddy TT. There is no comparison. Turbo is by far a better product. Low end torque is incredible!! The Vortech was as loud as hell and sounded like a cement mixer. Turbo is nice and quiet until it spools and then sweet music!!
Of course you will get people with the Vortech kit defending their expensive purchase. This is to be expected. I used to defend the SC as well.
I suggest that you contact companies that install these kits and get their opinions. I would predict that the majority of people who had a chance to compare the two would choose a ST or TT over a SC.
Of course you will get people with the Vortech kit defending their expensive purchase. This is to be expected. I used to defend the SC as well.
I suggest that you contact companies that install these kits and get their opinions. I would predict that the majority of people who had a chance to compare the two would choose a ST or TT over a SC.
#17
#18
turbos produce a LOT more heat. Heat is bad. Building up heat can heat the engine up especially if the turbos are right next to the engine in a compact engine bay. The turbos get red hot. They spin 2-3x as fast as superchargers to create more boost than what's needed and then send the extra wasted power out the wastegate. So you're creating more heat for something you're not really using. For some people that live in hotter climates, maybe they don't want that extra heat in their engine bay during the hot summer.
Compared to most superchargers, turbos produce full boost earlier where the engine's peak torque band is which means at around 4500 rpms the torque is MUCH higher than on a SC. Torque can break parts - which we know is a half truth cause boosting at high rpms can break things too which both SC's and turbos are going to do. If a car could be setup to run 800 tq and 400 hp, it'd blow much sooner than a car with 400 tq and 400 hp. Turbos actually produce a little more boost at 4000-4500 rpms than they do at redline from the graphs I've seen. Combine that with the engine naturally making more torque in that rpm range and it's no wonder turbos have so much more torque - and torque is how much force the engine is outputing without the frequency (rpms) factored in
But bottom line is we all know turbos produce more power across the entire power band and thus it's safe to say that stresses the engine more. We know superchargers have parasitic losses, but not enough to make up for a 70 ft/lb of torque advantage
An engine will be able to pump more air thru it at higher rpms. A turbo produces full boost early then pretty much holds it to redline. So if the turbo spools up throwing full boost into the engine at 4000 rpms, it will stress the engine a lot more than throwing that amount of boost into it when the engine is working at 6600 rpms and can deal with the load better. A centrifugal SC IMO is matched up perfectly with what the engine can handle because the boost is linked directly to the rpms, not exhaust gas velocity. Shoving 8 psi into the engine at 3300 rpms when it isn't breathing very fast can stress the engine, but at redline that's no sweat. That's why cams work so well with FI - they let the air in and out of the engine a better way
we're always hearing about how great it is that turbos spool up so soon, but when asked how much time at 3500 rpms at full boost do people spend in 3rd, 4th, 5th, or 6th gear, everyone always says you want to downshift so that you're higher up in the powerband cause otherwise you're just stressing the engine boosting at such a low rpm in a higher gear. Seems like a controdiction, but oh well. I'm sure it's fun having more low end torque
you also don't have to wait a minute and let the engine run to let the turbos cool off every time you want to stop the car - for all turbos except the APS ones anyway. Imagine going shopping in a turbo car and have to wait every time you stop. Yeah you can get a turbo timer though, just note it's not going to be compatible with an emanage ultimate if that's what you run. Superchargers don't deal with this issue cause they don't spin fast enough and heat up enough to have any risk of baking the oil into the turbo oil lines
Compared to most superchargers, turbos produce full boost earlier where the engine's peak torque band is which means at around 4500 rpms the torque is MUCH higher than on a SC. Torque can break parts - which we know is a half truth cause boosting at high rpms can break things too which both SC's and turbos are going to do. If a car could be setup to run 800 tq and 400 hp, it'd blow much sooner than a car with 400 tq and 400 hp. Turbos actually produce a little more boost at 4000-4500 rpms than they do at redline from the graphs I've seen. Combine that with the engine naturally making more torque in that rpm range and it's no wonder turbos have so much more torque - and torque is how much force the engine is outputing without the frequency (rpms) factored in
But bottom line is we all know turbos produce more power across the entire power band and thus it's safe to say that stresses the engine more. We know superchargers have parasitic losses, but not enough to make up for a 70 ft/lb of torque advantage
An engine will be able to pump more air thru it at higher rpms. A turbo produces full boost early then pretty much holds it to redline. So if the turbo spools up throwing full boost into the engine at 4000 rpms, it will stress the engine a lot more than throwing that amount of boost into it when the engine is working at 6600 rpms and can deal with the load better. A centrifugal SC IMO is matched up perfectly with what the engine can handle because the boost is linked directly to the rpms, not exhaust gas velocity. Shoving 8 psi into the engine at 3300 rpms when it isn't breathing very fast can stress the engine, but at redline that's no sweat. That's why cams work so well with FI - they let the air in and out of the engine a better way
we're always hearing about how great it is that turbos spool up so soon, but when asked how much time at 3500 rpms at full boost do people spend in 3rd, 4th, 5th, or 6th gear, everyone always says you want to downshift so that you're higher up in the powerband cause otherwise you're just stressing the engine boosting at such a low rpm in a higher gear. Seems like a controdiction, but oh well. I'm sure it's fun having more low end torque
you also don't have to wait a minute and let the engine run to let the turbos cool off every time you want to stop the car - for all turbos except the APS ones anyway. Imagine going shopping in a turbo car and have to wait every time you stop. Yeah you can get a turbo timer though, just note it's not going to be compatible with an emanage ultimate if that's what you run. Superchargers don't deal with this issue cause they don't spin fast enough and heat up enough to have any risk of baking the oil into the turbo oil lines
Last edited by sentry65; 07-18-2006 at 12:31 PM.
#19
i've had both types of cars. Turbos are lots of fun, but they are so much more tempermental when it comes to aftermarket turbo setups. Modded OEM turbo cars are fantastic, though.
I am going Vortech for these reasons, in no particular order:
1) easy install (DIY, I like to wrench on my car; it takes away the stresses of work!)
2) linear power curve (pulls like a bad *** N/A stroked smallblock V8 w/ a roller cam!)
3) less midrange torque is easier on the stock internals)
4) no boost spikes
5) easier to tune
6) love mechanical sounds that a blower makes! I even called Vortech to see if I could order one with the V1 series (straight cut gears) instead of the V2 (helical gears)
I am going Vortech for these reasons, in no particular order:
1) easy install (DIY, I like to wrench on my car; it takes away the stresses of work!)
2) linear power curve (pulls like a bad *** N/A stroked smallblock V8 w/ a roller cam!)
3) less midrange torque is easier on the stock internals)
4) no boost spikes
5) easier to tune
6) love mechanical sounds that a blower makes! I even called Vortech to see if I could order one with the V1 series (straight cut gears) instead of the V2 (helical gears)
#20
I've been loving my Vortech SC G since I bought it 6000 miles ago. It has been extremely reliable and I love the power curve. My last car was a 3000GT VR-4 with some mods so I know what a TT feels like on an AWD car.
If I had the choice and money wasn't a factor I would probably go with a fully built long block and a JWT TT setup. But unfortunately I don't have that kind of disposable income. I think the SC is great for a daily driven car.
As for the noise, well let's just say I don't hear a thing at idle since I had the idle raised to 750 and my JWT flywheel/clutch chatters louder than any Vortech. At speed it's hard to hear anything except the "spool" of the impeller drawing air since my exhaust gets pretty loud.
If I had the choice and money wasn't a factor I would probably go with a fully built long block and a JWT TT setup. But unfortunately I don't have that kind of disposable income. I think the SC is great for a daily driven car.
As for the noise, well let's just say I don't hear a thing at idle since I had the idle raised to 750 and my JWT flywheel/clutch chatters louder than any Vortech. At speed it's hard to hear anything except the "spool" of the impeller drawing air since my exhaust gets pretty loud.
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