Honda
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I think my post was deleted? Anyway... maybe if I say it nicer?
I took my car to get tuned at a -great- Honda tuner first. And he had other Nissans in the shop... so I figured all would be well. When I picked up the car cruising around would be at 10.0 A/F ratio... as I got on the gas it would lean out to around 13.5 at redline! He had everything backwards...
It cost me $2000 to get it fixed at a reputable Nissan tuner in Houston.
I took my car to get tuned at a -great- Honda tuner first. And he had other Nissans in the shop... so I figured all would be well. When I picked up the car cruising around would be at 10.0 A/F ratio... as I got on the gas it would lean out to around 13.5 at redline! He had everything backwards...
It cost me $2000 to get it fixed at a reputable Nissan tuner in Houston.
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From: NY
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This is my point.. Every tuner has it's own style of tuning. 12:1 A/F may work on Supra but not for us. Basically you can give them some guideline on what A/F ratio or timing you want to run. Guideline is not written in stone so they can go a few deg of on the timing or a few points on the A/F since every engine respond differently. Some Engine can ran a more timing without knocking but some dont. Going to a shop that really know our car is the first choice, and if not then I'll pick the shop who is a master of the EMS that I'm using and give them some idea on how I want to run my car. I will not trust my car to a Honda Shop without talking to them first though.
Most of the time I will talk to the tuner of the shop and ask how does he like his A/F and how does he go about Fuel Enrichment.. From there you will know if his style of tuning will work with our car. I think the bottom line here is that the tuner must tune using fundamentals and not pattern, every engine react differently. I like Church's response here and I think he nailed it pretty good.
This is my point.. Every tuner has it's own style of tuning. 12:1 A/F may work on Supra but not for us. Basically you can give them some guideline on what A/F ratio or timing you want to run. Guideline is not written in stone so they can go a few deg of on the timing or a few points on the A/F since every engine respond differently. Some Engine can ran a more timing without knocking but some dont. Going to a shop that really know our car is the first choice, and if not then I'll pick the shop who is a master of the EMS that I'm using and give them some idea on how I want to run my car. I will not trust my car to a Honda Shop without talking to them first though.
Most of the time I will talk to the tuner of the shop and ask how does he like his A/F and how does he go about Fuel Enrichment.. From there you will know if his style of tuning will work with our car. I think the bottom line here is that the tuner must tune using fundamentals and not pattern, every engine react differently. I like Church's response here and I think he nailed it pretty good.
Originally Posted by Churchautotest
Then his tuning ability wasn't based upon fundamental knowledge of engine behavior, but simply learned pattern responses for a particular group of engines. That's the critical difference between understanding the theory and practical application of engine behavior and just punching key in a manner that someone taught you.
IOW, be probably wasn't a good, careful and cautious tuner
SC
IOW, be probably wasn't a good, careful and cautious tuner
SC
Well, just for reference I'm referring to Tony Palo of T1 Race Development. He has one of the fastest and quickest Integras in the drag race scene running:
9.19 @ 164
9.27 @ 167
He's regarded as one of the best tuners around for any car. I'll have lengthy discussions with him before letting him tune anything. He's actually quoted on the EFI101.com website from back when he was Crew Chief for Jotech.
9.19 @ 164
9.27 @ 167
He's regarded as one of the best tuners around for any car. I'll have lengthy discussions with him before letting him tune anything. He's actually quoted on the EFI101.com website from back when he was Crew Chief for Jotech.
"I thought I knew a lot about tuning, but after listening to Ben, I realized that there is always more to learn! He has got to be one of the best at explaining difficult concepts and making it so that even a monkey could understand. I'd definitely recommend this class to anyone interested in learning about fuel injection!"
- Tony Palo, CrewChief,
Jotech Motorsports
- Tony Palo, CrewChief,
Jotech Motorsports
Last edited by waijai; Jan 8, 2008 at 03:41 PM.
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Joined: Oct 2005
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From: NY
If you have a good relationship with him then go for it. He seem to have an excellent background though. One thing I also look for a shop is character, I want to know if the shop will stand behind me if things go wrong. Usually if the shop is that good then they usually back up their work. There are some tuners out there that can be good but doesn't put enough time or at least not as meticulous on their work. Just my .02.
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