Yes that's a pretty decent definition of 'responsiveness'

To learn why, search the basic principles of air, venturis, high/low pressures, velocity, etc.

In the most basic terms:

A larger area doesn't promote high air flow at low RPM's.
Think about the 'pressure' in the intake stream.
Big opening, low pressure.
Small opening, high pressure.

You want to find the proper mix between these two so you still have pressure (velocity/speed) while maintaining an adequate Volume of air.

Too small and you have velocity but no volume. Too large and you have volume, but no velocity. Once the air is moving at a good rate, you want a larger opening, and this is why opening the throttle 100% would be beneficial, especially in the high RPM range.


So opening hte throttle 100% from a dead start isn't actually the best way to make power, you want to 'roll' the throttle on, or Start with your RPM's already high so the air is already flowing at higher speed before you take off.
If you've ever played around with starting from idle and buggering off, you'll notice that going WOT doesn't 'feel' as fast as putting the throttle down 1/2 way for a second while she starts pulling air in, THEN gradually increasing throttle.

this is the same reason you can often note NO difference between 1/2 throttle and WOT in actual power/pull.

 

Armchair engineering at it's finest, sir

 

I'm very interested in seeing this too man

 

According to TolBoothWilley, the throttle is already opened 100% until 5- 5.5k rpm's which is when it goes down to 80%. So if he is correct, opening the throttle to 100% won't reduce responsiveness (If you were even right in the first place) because thats what it is already set at. Instead, it will just give us more high end power like you were describing. Correct?

 

I'm not arguing the physics of air flow etc I'm simply pointing out how the VQ35DE responds to adjustments in the ecu tune. The Nissan ecu's are very advanced in that many of the values that we can "tune" are actually being modified or derived from complicated equations. I can't tell you of the end result of syncing the electronic throttle control is some other
variables being altered as well but the end result is a dramatic increase of responsiveness and butt dyno. I know dozens of people that have gotten tuned, and I've even done some tuning myself and the end result is always the same. On the VQ35DE, hr's don't respond quite so well. The factory tune has gotten progressively better with each generation, but for us DE guys there's a lot to be gained

 

I'm not arguing at all, I agree with everything you're saying. I was simply stating that altering the throttle to open to 100% in certain situations, mainly from idle, is not beneficial for responsiveness. Responsiveness, being the key word.
You simply don't want to go from idle to WOT if you're looking to get going quickly, that's not the best way to get the air pumping through the engine.

Admittedly, I have no idea, I'm pumped to hear that seymore has OEM Throttle Charts because that is sick info to posess, especially on this topic.

I'd like to re-itterate, I like this concept, I like the idea, I want to know more about it, especially if it's true that the throttle only opens to 80% at high RPM, I personally want to know how to change that, if it's true. I'm not saying doing it is a bad idea, at all. But knowing how engines work, and that it's more complex than a simple Open/Close scenario, especially when controlled electronically, makes me leary of someone simply changing their throttle control without a LOT more information and testing involved.

Now, the actual throttle response can simply be changed by changing the sensitivity of the pedal. A more sensitive pedal will improve responsiveness, and make the car 'feel' a LOT faster. This is one of the parameters that is modified in the tune that seymore is talking about, I'm sure.

 

Picture as promised. To keep it relevant to the sedan forum This is CM34A rom file, for a 2006 G35 sedan. the table on the left is the stock, untuned throttle table, the one on the right is the uprev tuned throttle table. You can see from the change in the values in the cells that the factory tune never completely opens the throttle at ANY rpm, and with the uprev tune it is maximized from 300 rpms on. I do not know exactly what correlation this has to other variables such as timing/ fuel compensation, like I said before it has been well documented by uprev that the values in the ecu work together and modify each other, so I don't think that syncing this to open 100% is the same as just dropping the throttle body 100% open. I'm sure it modifies the MAF signal or something else as well.



The picture turned out kind of small so I'm attaching it as well

 

Also another big benefit to the Osiris tuning is the ability to smooth out and correct the A/F (not to mention timing), in stock form its very rigid, uneven and inconsistent, and even if you're not tuning it to the perfect A/F ratio on a dyno just smoothing this out to be consistent helps out the engine immensely. Imagine you're pulling hard and the fuel mixture is going from rich to lean to rich to lean... not good for the spark plugs, not good for the engine. Another reason why Osiris tuned people comment that the car feels so much stronger and smoother pulling.

 

Can you explain the chart a bit, I am having a bit of trouble interpreting the information. What's "driving force", that seems to be the 'measurement' that's charted here?

 

I do not know, I just know that it works you could ask Uprev for the actual metrics behind it if you like. I can only tell you how its been explained to me and what I can see in the actual tuning software

 

Edit second chart makes much more sense to me. Odd to see a percentage number over 100%?

Are these WOT position maps?

 

I don't know how the values in the cells translate into throttle position, but I do know that it corresponds to throttle flow potential, with 3514 being the maximum. If that varies by throttle position or not, I do not know.

It would seem very reasonable that the value is based on some equation that they've worked out to extract the maximum flow for any given throttle position, since I know for a fact that the throttle does not physically open 100% at low rpms Like you were posting before that would be completely detrimental to the performance increase we're trying to get. Sorry if I came off bluntly my iphone is a POS and it drives me crazy when I try and post long drawn out things on the internet.

 

There is no difference between WOT and partial throttle maps, it just moves around on the chart depending on load and rpm.

 

Back to what OP was originally asking about:

Osiris is a license based system, much like Microsoft windows. The licenses are transported on the cipher cables, and then transferred to your ecu to make it tunable. The Protuners (shops) have a magic cable that can hold many licenses and flash as many ecu’s as long as they have licenses, which they buy from uprev. When a customer comes to the shop for a dyno tune they first flash a license onto the ecu, and then dyno tune the car using their protuner cable. The customer leaves with a tuned ecu containing one Osiris license.
When you buy direct from uprev you have to purchase a cipher cable as well as the license (Osiris standard for $500, or tuner for $700) because there is no way to transfer that license onto your ecu without the cable. The cipher cable is a usb-obd2 cable that by itself lets you monitor engine parameters, datalog, clear codes, and diagnose stuff. With Osiris standard the cable has the ability to store 1 osiris license, and flash rom files (tunes) onto and off the ecu. You cannot edit, modify, or even view tune files. Osiris tuner is a cipher cable that has special code in it that lets you do everything a cipher and Osiris standard cable can do, but also access the tuning functions. Real time tuning as well as the rom editor for desktop modifications.

As long as you have the cable you can reflash back to stock as much as you want, once the license is back on the cable you can use it on a different vehicle or sell it used in the marketplace. You will however need the rom file for the other vehicle before you can flash the license onto the ecu (there are many versions even for the same make/model)

You will see good gains from a tune, I have never heard of a single person being unhappy with it. Everyone is ear to ear grins. Check out this thread a good friend of mine started:
https://g35driver.com/forums/tuner-d...heets-ftw.html

He was almost stock and gained almost 20 ft/lbs or TQ... the peak HP isn't always a huge gain but the mid range, where you REALLY need it, always improves

 

Seymore, your contributions here have made this thread full of 100% win.

Not 110% though, just 100% Because wtf is 110%

Man, I've got a lot to learn about tuning. It's scary that I own a Haltech for this car.

At least I'm smart enough that I haven't plugged it in yet
I have waaaay too much more to learn before I do that.

Thanks for taking the time to explain a few things in a well constructed manner dude, seriously, thanks. I wish there was a "tuning for dummies" book. This shyt is complex when you have to learn it by "jumping in the ocean and learning how to swim out"