Hey guys, in need of some audio advice. As you may already know or can see from my signature, i have a JL 10w6v2 powered by a JL 500/1 amp and i absoultely love it. No problems at all. I also have applied sound deadener to trunk, trunk lid, and front doors. Everything sounds very good, but im not very satisfied when my sub cant hit high notes. I mostly listen to Dave Matthews and music like his, which often times contains alot of high bass notes that the sub cannot hit. To fix this i was thinking about putting a 8" mid bass speaker where the factory bose 8" sub sits in the rear panel of the sedans. as of right now my old bose is sitting there unpowered. Im running spock bose speakers, and honestly i dont really have a problem with them. imo, they dont sound THAT bad. I just wanted to hear yalls opinions of maybe putting in a 8" mid bass speaker such as the JL ZR800-CW or something in place of the old 8" bose sub. let me know what you think.

also, if i did this, could i still run my stock headunit and it sound ok. will it be able to get the correct audio signals from the stock HU. thanks

 

IMO, you are going to have integration issues if you are using the stock amp for an 8' MIDBASS replacement. More than likely you will be playing that sub in the same frequencies your existing sub is already playing. If you can put in an 8, and also have an amp that has a bandpass filter on it, then you could put in an 8" run it from 80-150/200 ish hz, and that will probably provide the kick you need.

In my opinion though....what you are experiencing is the poor quality of speakers in your front stage... replace the front speakers with some decent components that have good midbass response, run them down to 80hz, then you'll have a decent system. You will have to do another amp though, as the bose amp is eq'd etc for the existing speakers. Another JL amp (accepts balanced differential inputs, so no need for an line out converter) running Pioneer PRS components would probably do the trick, but also make sure you seal off the doors. This is will help in the midbass response. The PRS midbass woofers are loved in the audio community because they have strong midbass response.

You could do better, but the budget is an issue for most people....you can fit 8" midbasses in the doors...

don't know if it's relevant, but check out this install....one of my favorites and it's in a sedan... http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/...blew-up-g.html

anywho...just my two cents

 

Well if i do put a 8" midbass speaker where the factory 8" bose was, i would power it with an aftermarket amp. thinking of maybe doing something like an 300/4 and send 150 to this midbass speaker, and sending the other 150 to front components. i dont know which components i want, something good for the money. what do you guys think of this idea? I would be leaving the stock HU and i guess leave the oem dbose 6.5 speakers in the rears door powered?

 

Putting your midbass in the back would localize those notes in the back. Whereas subs can be put in the back and still appear to be playing up front due to the omnidirectional aspects of low frequency sound, you will definitely be able to tell where the midbass is coming from and it will mess with your setup. I was at one point thinking about doing something similar.

 

putting midbass in the back is not going to localize the notes unless you are playing it to high...ie 500hz. If you play the midbass 200hz - 80hz (which is what people consider midbass frequencies), and then your sub down from 80-20...that should work. however, you need to find a amp that has a bandpass filter (i'm not sure that the jl does) because if you have the 8 playing the same frequencies as the subs...that will mess up your sound.

Before going to all the effort of putting in the 8, you should really try a nice set of front components, power them well (no 25 watt crap) and then blend in your sub from where ever you are crossing over your components at...if that doesn't work...i'm not sure that i would still put in an 8 in the back....you could try it, but i don't think you will get the results you are looking for. but it's up to you....if i still didn't get the results I wanted with the 2ways, i would look for a nice 3 way component set.

me, i would go with http://www.woofersetc.com/p7162/UP6i...ent-System.htm
or http://www.woofersetc.com/p7165/Irid...ent-System.htm and then throw all the power you got at them.

Bing, an installer that has done many G's on this forum has run a lot of these components in cars and people always seem to be really happy. Check out his installs at http://simplicity.elitecaraudio.org/index.html

You really do have a lot of options...typically, when its the midbass that's lacking, its the front components that aren't doing their job. Oh, almost forgot to mention (don't remember if i already have, you NEED to sound deaden your doors...fill the holes and whatnot, and this will improve the lowend response your components. Check this out...cheaper than dynamat...does the same thing....http://www.secondskinaudio.com/vibra...damplifier.php

Hope this helps...any other questions, fire away.

 

I already have sound deadened front doors and trunk. and btw, secondskin isnt really any cheaper than dynamat anymore. its recognized as a good product now so they have bumped up the price. and im on a strict budget so im limited to what i can do (ie. definately not $600 components). I also most likely wont be doing an aftermarket HU. I dont think you understand what i was originally saying. its not that im lacking midbass... its more just simply that i would like to hit some higher notes that my 10w6v2 cant hit. and it was my understand that maybe a 8" midbass speaker could possibly help. thats the main question i was wondering.

 

i understand everything that you are saying...you want more midbass, then put in a different sub that will play higher, or build a different box to tune it to your liking...but you can't have both -- a sub that plays strong midbass AND extends low.

have you tried fidgeting with your crossover on your sub....try turning up the lp to 100hz, see if that works.

as i said earlier, midbass (typically 80-250 hz) is not sub territory. Its simply a function of how well your front speakers extend into the lower midbass frequencies.

you can try putting in an 8, but unless you seal up a smaller portion of the trunk, you are not going to get the midbass that you want, due to the fact that you are going to quickly over power the sub. In the stock location (i may be wrong) the sub just vents into the trunk right....no box? no semi sealed environment to help the suspension of the sub? If that's the case, then if you really want to try the 8 in the sub location, then find a sub that has a high qts (above .5 would be pref) and also has a higher fs. Then again, the amp you purchase needs to have a bandpass filter (not just a subsonic filter) to keep the two speakers from playing the same frequencies, and to help the 8" not over extend itself.

FWIW, I don't know of anyone that has done this, maybe someone else can speak up hear, but its def not the solution thats going to work for you IMO. you can try it, but again, my suggestion is to upgrade the front speakers (you don't have to upgrade the HU, and you don't have to buy a line out converter) just an amp that accepts balanced differential inputs -- JL handles that.

--or, what I am doing is putting 8's in the doors....there is your midbass...right in your face, up front...

if this doesn't help guide you, then I'm sorry. I would just hate for you to go through all that effort to find out it wasn't worth it. just my .02

 

appreciate it. someone else chime in? where are ya levon?

 

I have to agree with the suggestion to upgrade your door speakers. The stock ones are not all that great. But you don't have to go as high-end as DLS to greatly improve the sound. Infinity KAPPA 60.9CS or Reference 6030CS in the fronts and KAPPA 62.9I in the rear, all 4 of which will be about the same cost as just the front DLS's. You'll need another amp to drive them, but at 2 Ohm impedance, you won't need anything huge (400W at 2 Ohm should be enough to drive all 4). This is probably a better option for covering your mid-bass than trying to integrate what is basically a separate yet different subwoofer.

 

if i went with those infinity speakers, what amp would you recommend?

 

I'm just learning alot of this myself, so I'd rather not suggest a specific amp. Speakers are pretty straight forward, but I know there are some amp requirements if you're planning on keeping the stock Bose HU (differential inputs, 1-2 ohm stable). JL Audio makes good ones, as does Alpine. You can go higher end like Focal, but they're pretty pricey.

I'll have 2 amps in my setup, one for the door speakers and one for the sub, but I want to mount both somewhere near the existing amp, so size is a big consideration for me. I like the Alpine PDX 4.100 and the ARC Mini's for their size, but my research on amps is just beginning.

 

i don't mean to interject again, as it seems as though my advice wasn't liked....but I have never gotten good midbass out of Infinity products. So if your direction is to indeed move towards new front speakers for added midbass, IMO Infinity is the last place that I would turn to.

If you went without rear speakers, you would have a better sound image, could spend more money on decent front components, and also save on amps. But that is more of a personal decision, I don't like having sound all around me, but rather just in front. You could easily fade the speakers to the front, listen to it for a little bit, and see if you are missing anything. If no, then don't spend the extra money on the rears.

If DLS is too much, look at the Pioneer PRS Component Line. These have great midbass, many people love them. Also you could try http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...PPI+356CS.html The price is cheap, but they are basically rebranded ADS comps. that used to sell for hundreds more, and again, people rave about the clarity as well as the surprisingly strong midbass for 100 dollar comps.

again, all this is my .02, but I have been around 12volt for a while

 

If you went with the PPI comps or Pioneer comps, i would try this amp...easy integration as it will accept your differential inputs, and bridged power at 12volts give you 150x2...more than enough to make them sing...
http://www.woofersetc.com/p5583/A430...-Amplifier.htm

 

haha nah man, your advice is great appreciated. Im glad your helping me out. Im going to look more into those PPI components that you just sent me the url too. I dont have money right now to do anything with, but as soon as i do i want to get new speakers. and i think i agree with you that it would be better to do nice front speakers and leave the rears stock, than do average speakers in the front and rear. Thanks again for your help

 

you would suggest that over the JL 300/2?