ARC Front Strut Bar...help?
#166
02-05-2007, 07:04 PM
-
The materials Alu. Vs. Steel vs. Titanium is well studied
for bike use.
Steel is the most stiff (Higher Modulus) but most heavy (Specific Gravity).
Titanium is half as stiff as steel but lighter.
However, if one is happy with Titanium in a paticular application, for example
Ti ARC struct bar, then a Alu replica of the same exact dimention is only 30% less stiff compares to Titanium.
Consider the weight of Alu. that's 1/3 of the steel, & only 2/3 % of Titanium weight, Alu. may be the best material to use for a strut bar if it's not used in the most demanding situations. For most user, I believe it'll fall into this category.
Therefore, Alu. bar that's duplicated out of ARC Ti bar, l don't think it'll bend in any of my applications I'll encounter: i.e. a few fast turns at 0.7 lateral G, in a car that's farely rigid to begin with.
....................Modulus ......... Specific Gravity
Aluminum........10-11..............168.5
Steel..............30...................490
Titanium..........15-16.5............ 280
The only thing may stop me from buying will be the price, How much is it?
for bike use.
Steel is the most stiff (Higher Modulus) but most heavy (Specific Gravity).
Titanium is half as stiff as steel but lighter.
However, if one is happy with Titanium in a paticular application, for example
Ti ARC struct bar, then a Alu replica of the same exact dimention is only 30% less stiff compares to Titanium.
Consider the weight of Alu. that's 1/3 of the steel, & only 2/3 % of Titanium weight, Alu. may be the best material to use for a strut bar if it's not used in the most demanding situations. For most user, I believe it'll fall into this category.
Therefore, Alu. bar that's duplicated out of ARC Ti bar, l don't think it'll bend in any of my applications I'll encounter: i.e. a few fast turns at 0.7 lateral G, in a car that's farely rigid to begin with.
....................Modulus ......... Specific Gravity
Aluminum........10-11..............168.5
Steel..............30...................490
Titanium..........15-16.5............ 280
The only thing may stop me from buying will be the price, How much is it?
Last edited by ma_sha1; 02-05-2007 at 07:06 PM. Reason: -
#168
02-06-2007, 03:41 AM
#169
02-06-2007, 04:04 AM
Originally Posted by ma_sha1
The materials Alu. Vs. Steel vs. Titanium is well studied
for bike use.
Steel is the most stiff (Higher Modulus) but most heavy (Specific Gravity).
Titanium is half as stiff as steel but lighter.
However, if one is happy with Titanium in a paticular application, for example
Ti ARC struct bar, then a Alu replica of the same exact dimention is only 30% less stiff compares to Titanium.
Consider the weight of Alu. that's 1/3 of the steel, & only 2/3 % of Titanium weight, Alu. may be the best material to use for a strut bar if it's not used in the most demanding situations. For most user, I believe it'll fall into this category.
Therefore, Alu. bar that's duplicated out of ARC Ti bar, l don't think it'll bend in any of my applications I'll encounter: i.e. a few fast turns at 0.7 lateral G, in a car that's farely rigid to begin with.
....................Modulus ......... Specific Gravity
Aluminum........10-11..............168.5
Steel..............30...................490
Titanium..........15-16.5............ 280
The only thing may stop me from buying will be the price, How much is it?
for bike use.
Steel is the most stiff (Higher Modulus) but most heavy (Specific Gravity).
Titanium is half as stiff as steel but lighter.
However, if one is happy with Titanium in a paticular application, for example
Ti ARC struct bar, then a Alu replica of the same exact dimention is only 30% less stiff compares to Titanium.
Consider the weight of Alu. that's 1/3 of the steel, & only 2/3 % of Titanium weight, Alu. may be the best material to use for a strut bar if it's not used in the most demanding situations. For most user, I believe it'll fall into this category.
Therefore, Alu. bar that's duplicated out of ARC Ti bar, l don't think it'll bend in any of my applications I'll encounter: i.e. a few fast turns at 0.7 lateral G, in a car that's farely rigid to begin with.
....................Modulus ......... Specific Gravity
Aluminum........10-11..............168.5
Steel..............30...................490
Titanium..........15-16.5............ 280
The only thing may stop me from buying will be the price, How much is it?
Scott has tried aluminum braces before setteling on the aircraft steel he uses to make them now. The aluminum failed then, what makes you think it won't fail now? Especially in that flex-provokeing "ARC" shape of these style braces. Scotts brace is very strong, straight, and weighs like 5 lbs.
If like you say, steele is almost 3 times stronger than aluminum than I am MORE than happy with my steel brace
Thank you very much. 
#170
02-06-2007, 07:06 AM
#171
02-06-2007, 01:45 PM
Originally Posted by Native1
Especially in that flex-provokeing "ARC" shape of these style braces.
ideal for a strut bar. i am more accustomed to flat/straight bars on
previous cars (ive used mostly cusco and spoon parts).
but from wat i can feel, the titanium is strong enough to at least
help support the flex of the chassis. it was quite a difference before/after.
im not sure how strong that aluminum can support. be worth a try though.
wat i was a little dissappointed was the bend angle on the aluminum
bar. it appears to have a bigger bend than the Arc...which means more
prone to bending.
will have to see.
#174
02-07-2007, 07:50 AM
-
I agree it's a little on the high side. We'll see how many
will join the G
roup buy.
I will hop in if the Group buy is around $200. Regular price in the $250 range sound fair. $350 may be a hard sell for 2 reasons.
1, No R&D expense to justify cost, It's a copy cat item from ARC.
2, Alu. is dirt cheap compares to Ti, Alu. Bar that size cost $20 in Home deopt.
3, If $350 price doesn't drop, you'll likely see "replica of replica" made exact same way soon that sells for $200 or less. many Alu. strut bars on ebay sells for $20-40 including shipping. At surrent price, There are too much margin for this replica to lure competition in for "Replica of the Replica".
4, From business angle, best pricing strategy should consider both price & quantity sold, Better profit is achived by selling 200 bars at $200 each than selling 20 Bars at 300 each.
will join the G
roup buy.
I will hop in if the Group buy is around $200. Regular price in the $250 range sound fair. $350 may be a hard sell for 2 reasons.
1, No R&D expense to justify cost, It's a copy cat item from ARC.
2, Alu. is dirt cheap compares to Ti, Alu. Bar that size cost $20 in Home deopt.
3, If $350 price doesn't drop, you'll likely see "replica of replica" made exact same way soon that sells for $200 or less. many Alu. strut bars on ebay sells for $20-40 including shipping. At surrent price, There are too much margin for this replica to lure competition in for "Replica of the Replica".
4, From business angle, best pricing strategy should consider both price & quantity sold, Better profit is achived by selling 200 bars at $200 each than selling 20 Bars at 300 each.
#175
02-07-2007, 10:23 AM
Originally Posted by ma_sha1
I agree it's a little on the high side. We'll see how many
will join the G
roup buy.
I will hop in if the Group buy is around $200. Regular price in the $250 range sound fair. $350 may be a hard sell for 2 reasons.
1, No R&D expense to justify cost, It's a copy cat item from ARC.
2, Alu. is dirt cheap compares to Ti, Alu. Bar that size cost $20 in Home deopt.
3, If $350 price doesn't drop, you'll likely see "replica of replica" made exact same way soon that sells for $200 or less. many Alu. strut bars on ebay sells for $20-40 including shipping. At surrent price, There are too much margin for this replica to lure competition in for "Replica of the Replica".
4, From business angle, best pricing strategy should consider both price & quantity sold, Better profit is achived by selling 200 bars at $200 each than selling 20 Bars at 300 each.
will join the G
roup buy.
I will hop in if the Group buy is around $200. Regular price in the $250 range sound fair. $350 may be a hard sell for 2 reasons.
1, No R&D expense to justify cost, It's a copy cat item from ARC.
2, Alu. is dirt cheap compares to Ti, Alu. Bar that size cost $20 in Home deopt.
3, If $350 price doesn't drop, you'll likely see "replica of replica" made exact same way soon that sells for $200 or less. many Alu. strut bars on ebay sells for $20-40 including shipping. At surrent price, There are too much margin for this replica to lure competition in for "Replica of the Replica".
4, From business angle, best pricing strategy should consider both price & quantity sold, Better profit is achived by selling 200 bars at $200 each than selling 20 Bars at 300 each.
#176
02-07-2007, 10:27 AM
Yes, I agree with ma_sha...If the regular price is already $325, then I'd rather just pay more and get the VRT bar since it's got great reviews.
With a replica, I was hoping it'd be in the sub-$200 range for a regular price, and in the $150 range for a GB price.
Maybe if the price were lower, more people would jump on this and they'd be able to push much more volume and capture more of the market before the replica of the replica is released.
With a replica, I was hoping it'd be in the sub-$200 range for a regular price, and in the $150 range for a GB price.
Maybe if the price were lower, more people would jump on this and they'd be able to push much more volume and capture more of the market before the replica of the replica is released.
#178
02-07-2007, 01:08 PM
-
There is only one guy jumped in at the current Group buy.
Let's start a Un-santioned Hyper Group Buy, kind of like Priceline.com, we name our own price. Put in the asking price of $200 shipped, I am confident that if there are enough people, they'll consider selling it to our group at $200 a piece if the current selling price can't move the product. It's better than sitting on the inventory of a bunch of bars with no cash flow.
"A bar is only as good as what people are willing to pay for"
-Albert Einstein
So, For $200 Shipped. Willing Buyers please put your name down:
1, ma_sha1
2, cato
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10,
Let's start a Un-santioned Hyper Group Buy, kind of like Priceline.com, we name our own price. Put in the asking price of $200 shipped, I am confident that if there are enough people, they'll consider selling it to our group at $200 a piece if the current selling price can't move the product. It's better than sitting on the inventory of a bunch of bars with no cash flow.
"A bar is only as good as what people are willing to pay for"
-Albert Einstein
So, For $200 Shipped. Willing Buyers please put your name down:
1, ma_sha1
2, cato
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10,
Last edited by cato; 02-07-2007 at 01:17 PM.
#179
02-07-2007, 03:44 PM
Originally Posted by ma_sha1
There is only one guy jumped in at the current Group buy.
Let's start a Un-santioned Hyper Group Buy, kind of like Priceline.com, we name our own price. Put in the asking price of $200 shipped, I am confident that if there are enough people, they'll consider selling it to our group at $200 a piece if the current selling price can't move the product. It's better than sitting on the inventory of a bunch of bars with no cash flow.
"A bar is only as good as what people are willing to pay for"
-Albert Einstein
So, For $200 Shipped. Willing Buyers please put your name down:
1, ma_sha1
2, cato
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10,
Let's start a Un-santioned Hyper Group Buy, kind of like Priceline.com, we name our own price. Put in the asking price of $200 shipped, I am confident that if there are enough people, they'll consider selling it to our group at $200 a piece if the current selling price can't move the product. It's better than sitting on the inventory of a bunch of bars with no cash flow.
"A bar is only as good as what people are willing to pay for"
-Albert Einstein
So, For $200 Shipped. Willing Buyers please put your name down:
1, ma_sha1
2, cato
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10,
#180
02-07-2007, 04:31 PM
