If that were the case, I'm confused by your comments. Your previous comments were to clarify it was inconclusive as to Mobil's base stocks. I'm confused as to why you choose to specifically address this specific subject if it weren't revelant to the overall conversation at all. Especially when this thread is specifically about Mobil 1's base stocks.

For the record, I never questioned Mobil 1's quality or it's ability to protect. I was addressing the point of the thread. And that was Mobil 1's definition of "synthetic". Which is briefly (but indirectly) is addressed in the article you posted (one that you apparently legitimized).

 

 

Although I'll generally agree that due to the oil change frequency of most here, oil brand is less important.

But I'll also point out that instances of oil related engine failures isn't a good example in this discussion.

One could run oil damaged for many miles. A neglected engine that's running far from it's peak performance potential is still a running engine.

 

The bottom line for me, pushing aside the academics, is that I drive slowly, methodically, deliberately and like an old man in a hat-- as such, whichever synthetic (Amsoil, Mobil 1, PP, RP, urine samples, etc.) will suffice. I'd be more particular if the car was pushed aggressively, at that point I'd be counting metal shavings in the oil, getting my oil analyzed, driving in the buff to reduce weight, and shaving my head to reduce wind resistance.

Now, on a more interesting topic, "IMAFUKINRIDER," do you have any more pictures of hotties wrestling?

 

Based on the evidence I've seen and the article you posted, I still say Mobil 1 (in most grades) is no longer a group IV sythetic based oil like they used to be.

In the whole scheme of things, it could have little revelancy. But when you are sitting there in the oil section, ready to plunk down the extra $$ required to purchase a synthetic, you will try to purchase the best oil that you are willing to pay. IMHO, at that time, knowing what your oil choice is made up of, now becomes important. Would you pay Amsoil prices for a WalMart branded generic oil? Even if both would most likely protect your engine pretty much the same way (given your driving habits)?

 

Again, from my readings, it seems that Mobil 1 has been on that slippery slope of group IV motor oils, the definition of which has been slackened so that it can legally refer to itself as fully synthetic. What we don't really know is what percentage of it is group III and what is group IV-- 20%, 35%, 50%, 75%???? Amsoil does tell you, on every bottle I believe, what it's made of: Mobil 1 does not and calls it proprietary information.

Mobil one, on it's website, states clearly that it needn't challenge or respond to Amsoil's claims since the proof is in the pudding-- racers use Mobil 1, Amsoil is not mentioned, therefore, Mobil 1 must be superior (to use their logic)!!! What do you think?

 

One might not know what % of Mobil 1 is group IV. As I've said before, look at the ORDER in which the state their ingredients. Most if not all ingredients are listed in the order of most to least. Group IV isn't listed 1st (might not even be listed 2nd). So that means (to me)
1) It's not a Group IV based oil (why would they list it twice?)
2) It's not the main ingredient.

Mobil 1 doesn't tell you simply because it doesn't have to. The engineer that replied to my email gives us a clue. But that's about it.

So again, you have xx dollars to spend on your next oil. You're standing there trying to choose. Which one would you rather have?

 

Here's what I "know" (can one really know one knows??):
A) Group IV (PAOs) = Amsoil (except XL), Royal Purple, DSI, North American Lubricants, Amtecol, Eneos, Castrol (German Castrol that is) among others.

B) Group V (esters)= Motul, Elf, Redline, Maxima/Maxum4, Kem-o-pro, Neo, and silkolene among other.

You can “Google” these to get a better idea of each one's synthetic base.

For the price and my purposes, I'll be changing to Amsoil the next go-around! No thanks to your persistence!

 

Just as a quickie intro to esters for those who may not be familiar. If my memory works, ester oil molecules are made up of the positively polarized Oxygen (O) and the negatively polarized Hydrogen (H). Collectively, both molecules "absorb" into the metal electrically to form a molecular film: in conventional oils (groups II, III, IV) this film is created by viscosity. If someone knows more about this or if I missed the mark, please feel free to correct me.

And there you have it: bio-physics 101.

 

Yep.

This is a good place to end this thread.

 

Nah.... it may end here, but the same debate will go on elsewhere. Someone else will start the issue and in 1-2 months, we'll have a raging debate. This is one of several threads with the identical topic- not sure why it keeps getting resurrected?

 

Ah ha!

Gee Braintree, why isn't Mobil 1 on that your list for Group IV? hehe j/k.

IMHO, you don't need the Amsoil. But if your engine is up the task, you could run it on extended drain intervals in order to recoup some of the costs.

 

Why? It's not what the thread was originally about?

 

It seems Mobil 1 is not considered by those "in the know", to be a "true" group IV (more of a hybrid group III and IV). I run Mobil 1 extended and run it 10K with 1 filter change every 5K. The engine uses about 1 cup of oil per 3K . Keep in mind that my driving style is akin to this guy below.

Also, I'm extremely environmentally conscientious (not in the same fashion as Americans) so do everything I can to protect that which is sacred (Americans struggle with this one and have a one-dimensional view of environmental concern).

My shift to Amsoil will be for the even longer periods between changes-- more environmentally friendly and is less connected to whether or not Mobil 1 is a group IV motor oil. Overall, this has been educational from a lubricants perspective. Thanks for pushing the issue!

 

Awesome! I'd like to run extended drains also but I tend to use a touch too much for that. After about 4k, I'm about 1 qt down. I'd be topping off and eventually replacing the whole 5 qts before the interval is up. Thus I find the best group III oil I can find for the price and run a fairly short oil change.