Couple of things...

1. The torque spec is a maximum of 60 in-ozs, not 80.
2. Kinetix knew about cracking issues and offered a fix, a new plenum. They are not responsible for giving someone their money back, just fixing their product.
3. The owner of the vehicle has a responsibility to NOT DRIVE his/her car in an unsafe situation. Knowing about cracked plenum issues (and knowing about a free replacement and not asking for one) is not Kinetix's problem.
4. I honestly believe that if someone orders a Kinetix plenum, installs it properly, inspects it frequently, there will not be any problems with it.

However, for the record, I chose Crawford as my plenum of choice to avoid problems like this. I've seen the construction of both plenums (actually held both in my hands) and must say that I'm more impressed with the workmanship of the Kinetix than I am of the Crawford. Crawford's big plus is that it's not plastic, that's all.

<font color=blue>The above statements are only my take on the issue. If you disagree with anything I typed then you are 100% right!</font color=blue>

 

Neff,
Surely you meant 60 inch-pound rather than 'inch-ounce'. LOL ... that would have been less than even a finger tight with massive leaks all around. The factory spec for the nuts and bolts to the plenum is 9-10 ft-lbs or 108-120 inch-lbs. Kinetix conservatively suggests 60 inch-lbs (5 ft-lbs) in their manual for the obvious reason. My suggestion is 80 inch-lbs (~6.7 ft-lbs) for good measure. Again, this should be performed with a well calibrated torque wrench.


Clint (THX723)

 

Clint,

I just checked the service manuals.

The intake manifold collector torque specs are found between pages EM-17 and EM-22 depending on which version of the manual you have.

The Intake Manifold Collector - Removal and Installation picture show the torque specs to be 9 or 9-10 ft/lbs (108-120 in/lbs).

A couple of pages later you'll find the Intake Manifold Collector (Upper) picture which specifies the bolt tightening sequence as well as a different torque value. The text states...

"If stud bolts were removed, install them and tighten them to the torque specified below."

---- 4.9 - 6.9 N.m (0.5 - 0.7 kg-m, 44 - 61 in-lb) ----


By the way, try as I might, I couldn't find an in-oz torque value or conversion for same anywhere in the manual.



DaveO
03 G35 AT Sedan / DP / Willow / Premium / Sport / Aero / Mods

 

Dave,
That is correct and a good catch. i stand corrected. I mis-read the diagram on EM-16. So, Kinetix's suggestion of 60 in-lbs would have been fine. Keep in mind most 75/85 lb-ft. garage torque wrenches are not accurate enough at such low range ... they tend to read optimisticly high (making for loser nutz and bolts).

Interestingly enough, I heard some Crawford users are having to over-torque due to warpage ... how much over torquing are we talking about? Any clue? I'd imagine well over 20-25 ft-lbs to be breaking studs.

By the way ... here's the math:

1 ft-lbs = 12 inch-lbs = 192 inch-ounce


Clint (THX723)

 

Oh and dont' forget to thread lock. These things will undo itself at such low torque spec over time.

Clint (THX723)

 

Yea not a smart move taking a long drive at high speeds knowing you had even the tinest little crack or cracks!! But I know, you've also heard this from like 20 other people in this thread already, just refreshing your memory. All I have to say is that sucks man. They should DEF. give you back your refund, towing I dont know about either. I was gonna go with the kinetix plenum but now im really shakey on this considering alot of the mods will need airflow and might make this plenum worse than on a stock engine. Damm well try and get your money back and lucky you werent going around the turn also... Good luck with it, Martin


Martin
2003.5 BS G35
Nismo Aero/Sport Package
Injen CAI
B+G Springs
ADR M-Classic 19's..

 

Well, I'm one hour away from starting the engine after installing the kinetix plenum. I don't have a torque wrench for something less than 10 foot-pounds, so I just had to give it my best judgement. I still have to wait since the thread lock recommendation states to wait a minimum of 2 hours for it to dry up. I just hope that after I cranck the engine, the CEL light won't come on. Then I will take it for a spin and see how it goes. Does anybody has recommendations whether I should reset the ECU or should I just leave it to figure out the fuel/air mixture on its own after driving it for a few days???

2004 G35 Coupe/OB/Graphite interior/Premium and aero package/Popcharger/Z tube/Hotchkis sways/Tein H-tech springs/Kinetix plenum/Crawford cats

 

Ya shouldn't expect any CEL if all wires, harnesses, tubes are connected before you reconnect the battery and crank her.

I did the ECU reset by diconnecting the battery connectors then shorted them together for the duration of my install. Once the thread lock cured, I let her idle for a bit then went ***** out. I felt the difference in the power curve fairly readily. Looking back, it's even better some 300 miles later (could very well have been psychological).

That's my story so far ... let us know how yours went!


Clint (THX723)<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small"><EM>Edited by THX723 on 07/06/04 07:04 PM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

G35_TX:

Thanks for forwarding the post, and sorry some of us having mistaken it to be YOU who experienced this, rather than the person who originated the thread on 350Z.com (from where you forwarded it).

Don't let it deter you from future dessimination of such information, my good man - it sure prompted a lot of discussion here, didn't it ?

Sport Sedan Fan - 2004 6MT Sedan
Sport/Navigation/Premium/Aero; "Invisiguard" Bra, Madico Onyx Tint
Obsidian Black/Graphite & "Titanium"
SHE'S SILVER & BLACK - GO RAIDERS!

 

Clint,

I don't know much about Crawford users are having to over-torque due to warpage. Hopefully everyones aware that they should follow the bolt tightening sequence and torque the bolts in at least two steps. IMO, it's pretty easy to warp the surfaces if you get the plenum mis-aligned and/or tighten the hold down bolts unevenly.

My Crawford V-5 went on without a hitch. I followed the factory tightening sequence (skipping bolts 3, 4 ,5 & 6 of course) and torqued the bolts in three stages ending up at 55 in-lbs. No leaks, no runs, no errors.

Here's a picture of the factory tightening sequence for those who don't have a manual. My thanks to whoever originally posted this picture.



DaveO
03 G35 AT Sedan / DP / Willow / Premium / Sport / Aero / Mods

293475-step10a.jpg

 

Dave,
Thanks for clearing that up. Yes, I too followed the bolt pattern described by the service manual and should have pointed out that it's equally equally important. I took extra precaution (being plastic and all) by making 4 *complete* rounds that slowly build up to the torque spec.


Clint (THX723)

 

I don't own an aftermarket plenum, but after reading about this whole mess...... My conclusion is that Kinetix made a crappy product, and then updated it with more crappy products. I don't know how often automobile plastic crack or just break off all of a sudden, but this plenum just sounds like a piece of unsafe garbage. I would never consider buying one, and I hope current owners all have the option to return this product for a full refund.

 

It's amazing how some people, myself included, buys it anyways. It's like smoking ... you know it could be bad ... but you do it anyways (btw ... I don't smoke). Honestly, I'm torned ... this being my very first Kinetix plenum and if you'd ask me if I'd do it again I would say 'yes' in a heartbeat. That is not to say I'll readily recommend it to a friend at this time, however. At least, not until it's shown to have improved reliability.
It's a calculated risk I'm taking ... if the numbers play out, could also be rewarding. Fingers crossed (very tightly).


Clint (THX723)

 

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

Fingers crossed (very tightly).

<hr></blockquote>

How tightly? 60 in-oz.?

G

2003.5 Black w/ Willow G35
Premium / Sport / Aero / Winter / Navi / Tint
<font color=blue>Z-tube, Pop-charger, Borla True-Dual Exhaust, Eibach Pro Kit, GroundingGear</font color=blue>

 

My whole take on this thing: What is the overall percentage of (known) failure with the product? Saying the Kinetix Plenum is worthless because it of the possibility of cracking based on the misfortune of a few doesn't seem logical. That's like shutting down a theme park because someone gets injured, or shutting down all airlines because of a fatal crash.

I'm still a big advocate of the product and have to admit that it is BEYOND assinine to drive around with a plenum that already had cracks in it. Sorry but that is just pure stupidity.