a complete car? which two of these three, G35, STi, Evo, out of the box is ready for the track? which gets to 60 in under 5 seconds? slaloms at over 70 mph (700 foot)? carries 5 people with a trunk big enough to tote their weekend luggage? which gets around safely, nevermind better than most SUVs, in the snow? corners like a go-kart on dry or wet pavement?

By now you've probably guessed that it's the STi and Evo...maybe our definition of "complete" cars is different...

 

agreed... Best compromise for Luxury, Performance, and Styling, IMO

 

Yup. I missed the styling part. Good job pointing it out

 

If you think about it, the STI is more practicle than a G coupe. I think some people are confusing the term "practicality" with "aesthetic acceptance." Certainly on paper, the G is more practicle regarding it's looks, but certainly not it's usabilty and performance. The STI is all-wheel-drive vehicle which enables one to drive year-around, regardless of weather conditions. likewise, it has more usable room for storage, etc. It weighs less and has more HP. And it's cheaper in cost. And subaru has bullet proof engines! The G coupe is a rear-wheel drive car that certainly sucks in the snow...at least mine did. Plus, a basketball will fill the trunk! Most people with a G, put it in storage at first sight of snow or heavy rain. I think the G, along with the TSX, TL, Lexus and others pretty much offer the same package in some areas regarding performance..and i stress the word "some" so don't flame! After you get over the leather seats, and goodlooking **** on the stereo console, what else is there?

 

I won't answer your last question, because you should do the research on the G35's luxury features. Anyway, I've driven my coupe through two winters in Chicago. All I need to do is swap out my summer setup to my winter setup. Please don't tell me you EVO/WRX guys are driving around on summer tires in the winter just because you have awd. So basically there is really no difference when you have to swap out tires on both vehicles. The VDC is very effective on the G35 in the winter with a good set of winter tires, but then again I'm giving you a clue on G35 features.

 

Look, i'm not trying to **** anyone off.. just trying to provoke some discussion, that's all.

And i too OWNED a 2003 6mt coupe with all the bells and whistles when they first dropped! And anyone that knows about cars, knows that a rear wheel drive vehicle in the snow is horrible. I didn't say that one couldn't risk driving in the winter..hell you could ride a motorcycle in the winter if you're determined! And yes i DID stay on my stock Potenzas in the winter! Not a good idea by some, but i just allowed more time for travel and kept a safe distance between myself and others! And the car was a beast!

 

I live in the south, so I obviously don't get snow in the sense that midwestern or northeastern people do. Having said that, I did on numerous occasions drive my WRX in the snow and ice, with the same tires that I ran all summer long. Tires are a huge factor, of course, but the AWD system that Subaru makes is simply phenomenal. A Camaro would be stuck, spinning his tires to try to get traction in front of me. I'd just feather out the clutch and drive around him.

 

If you were driving on all-seasons, then you're not so bad. However, if you were driving on summer tires, then you're asking for trouble. AWD will not help you when you're driving around on 4 plastic big wheel tires. It's the tire compound and thread that makes summer tires "summer tires" and winter tires "winter tires".

Once again, have you driven your Coupe in snow? Like I said, I and many others have driven our cars through two winters with a good set of winter tires and the coupe performed quite well. I've never been stuck spinning while looking for traction unless I turn off VDC Anyone that knows about cars should know that the stock 18s on the Coupe are useless in the snow. That's probably why you got the results you did (horrible), but then again you are driving around on summer tires in the winter and think that AWD will save you. Look closely and you'll see the G35 isn't the only RWD car on the road in the winter. This would include Police cars, city buses, and yes, the salt trucks to name a few. I once saw a pic of an EVO with summer tires that slid into a porta-potty while trying to Auto-X in cold weather. He slid off the track and over a curb and into the porta-potty. I know someone could've been killed, but I couldn't stop laughing.

 

Again, in NC, we don't really spend a lot of time differentiating between "summer" tires and "winter" tires. There's no big transition here where everyone spends their weekend changing up tires on their car. They were indeed a performance tire, but they did alright in the snow as long as the speeds were kept relatively low.

 

taken from http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthr...pwns+evo+potty


He was running on R-compound tires, not stock tires (which are still summer-only) He was running a competition event, at high speeds and hit ice on R-compounds. The fact that he lost control and whacked up an occupied (teehee!) porta-potty has no bearing on whether AWD or RWD is better for snow driving. On the same winter setup, an STi or Evo will out accellerate, out brake and out handle a G. On the same summer setup, even in snow, the STi and Evo will still out-perform...the fact that this guy more than pushed the limits with improper equiment in a race environment is irrelevant to your argument.

i agree with you that it is very possible to drive a G in the winter and i commend you for keeping your car on the road across all of the seasons. the point is that the STi/Evo is more capable of handling all weather conditions than the G.

no one was saying that you can't do it in a G...I was trying to make the point that the comment about a more "complete" car was completely unfounded and ridiculous

 

Have i driven in the snow with my G35? Uh...yes, i had the car for 16 months! I never mentioned that my All-wheel-drive system would "save" me but i do trust it more so than a rear wheel drive car! With that said, most accidents are from driver related errors anyway, e.g. putting too much faith in your car's ability, like SUV drivers. I saw that photo regarding the evo accident.. i think the kid couldn't drive and lost control (too much power). Hell... people lose control with cars in the most ideal weather (hot temp with sticky roads), so your comment doesn't hold too much weight imo!
Plus i think statistics show that more vehicle accidents occur in the summer anyway!

 

Tires, we are talking about tires here...not rwd vs awd. I'm well aware of the benefits of awd, but we are talking about tires here, which you just proved my point. Any car, whether its awd, fwd, or rwd with improper tires in the winter is dangerous.

I completely agree, but only if both cars are equipped with similar performing tires. Don't try to tell me an EVO/STi on R-compounds will out-accellerate and out-handle me on my Dunlop M3s in 15 degree weather.


I brought up tires into the discussion because of this statement:
No more horrible than any vehicle on improper tires.

Well, see now you're talking about bad drivers, which has nothing to do with tires. The only reason I bought up the porta-potty EVO was because it doesn't matter what you're driving when you're wearing the wrong tires. Once again, AWD has its limits when you're running summer tires in the winter. I'm sure an EVO/Sti on winter tires is something awesome to experience in the snow. Once again, I'm not turning this into a awd vs rwd arguement. I agree that awd is a better performance setup. This is about tires and how many many rwd vehicles are driven during the winter with the proper tires.

 

sorry, i guess i missed your point. i agree with you though...I've had fun driving an RX8 and an RX7 through the snow...both properly equipped with snow tires...RWD definitely can do it and can do it well.

i was trying to get more to the point about the STi/Evo being incomplete cars which isn't the case.

 

STi is practical, but it will wear you out more than G Coupe would on long drives. I drive 400 miles to VA from OH and back frequently, so I needed a car that is comfortable on long drives. I don't see any problems with using G in light snow with snow tires... I don't drive in heavy snows anyway no matter what car I have.

TSX, TL, and Lexus doesn't match the performance of G. Acuras are FWD, which is inferior in terms of performance, and has less power than G. Lexus is just simply laggin in power department with their IS300... So the G coupe is the best performing car in this segment.

After I get over the leather seats and good looking *****, there is comfortable ride, more safety, and overall better quality car than STi or Evo. Oh, plus a lot better styling I'm willing to sacrifice some performance in order to get those other things the G can provide over STi or Evo or any other cars in this price range.

 

What makes you think the STI is unbearable for long drives? I recently drove 8 hours strait in my STI and it was a cake walk. Those rumors you hear about the STI's horrible drivability in everyday driving/long commutes is completely false! Again..when you look at the packages Acura/Lexus/infiniti and other cars in that category offer they are almost identical, minus the great design of the G. More Safety???