Motordyne Plenum Spacer Vs Crawford V5
#93
02-02-2005, 05:26 PM
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#94
02-04-2005, 12:35 AM
I'm not calling BS on anything by any means but the A/F graph seems to be a little troubling. Most of the A/F charts I've seen (including mine) have a ratio of around 14:1 (which if I understand correctly is stoich) up until 5000-5500 rpms. At that point, the A/F ratio gets richer which again, if I understand correctly, helps keep the engine cooler (longevity) at the expense of optimum HP output/efficiency.
Although a lean condition on a NA engine isn't as dangerous as one on an engine with FI (running 11:1, 10:1, or even richer at redline), is this something one should worry about?
I honestly don't think it would matter too much for someone doing stoplight racing where the engine is in the upper rev range for very short periods of time but would this be a concern for someone out on the track, road racing, where you spend extended periods of time (all of it ideally) close to redline?
Although a lean condition on a NA engine isn't as dangerous as one on an engine with FI (running 11:1, 10:1, or even richer at redline), is this something one should worry about?
I honestly don't think it would matter too much for someone doing stoplight racing where the engine is in the upper rev range for very short periods of time but would this be a concern for someone out on the track, road racing, where you spend extended periods of time (all of it ideally) close to redline?
Last edited by al503; 02-04-2005 at 12:40 AM.
#95
02-04-2005, 02:01 AM
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Originally Posted by al503
I'm not calling BS on anything by any means but the A/F graph seems to be a little troubling. Most of the A/F charts I've seen (including mine) have a ratio of around 14:1 (which if I understand correctly is stoich) up until 5000-5500 rpms. At that point, the A/F ratio gets richer which again, if I understand correctly, helps keep the engine cooler (longevity) at the expense of optimum HP output/efficiency.
Although a lean condition on a NA engine isn't as dangerous as one on an engine with FI (running 11:1, 10:1, or even richer at redline), is this something one should worry about?
I honestly don't think it would matter too much for someone doing stoplight racing where the engine is in the upper rev range for very short periods of time but would this be a concern for someone out on the track, road racing, where you spend extended periods of time (all of it ideally) close to redline?
Although a lean condition on a NA engine isn't as dangerous as one on an engine with FI (running 11:1, 10:1, or even richer at redline), is this something one should worry about?
I honestly don't think it would matter too much for someone doing stoplight racing where the engine is in the upper rev range for very short periods of time but would this be a concern for someone out on the track, road racing, where you spend extended periods of time (all of it ideally) close to redline?
If you're that serious into things then wouldn't you be doing some ECU tuning after any mods anyway?
#97
02-04-2005, 09:05 AM
Originally Posted by copbait
If you're that serious into things then wouldn't you be doing some ECU tuning after any mods anyway?
so are you stating that a TS ECU reflash is something that is recommended/required for this mod not to blow your engine? I purchased the spacer before really scrutinizing the A/F ratio but if it introduces the opportunity for detonation b/c of running lean...than thats not something I am willing to jeopardize. I would much rather run lean and detonate w/ FI, rather than a $160 spacer. My spacer delivery was pushed back by UPS to the 10th so I wont be able to test it until then. I live in VA so it wont be simple getting an ECU reflash from TS, so please let me know if the spacer does increase the potential for running dangerously lean. I know that with all performance parts there is the potential for damage, but for one that is/might be exponential??? As an example, exhaust/intake do not drastically increase that potential. I just assumed this was a safe/simple mod and a cheaper alternative to a crawford plenum that allowed you to keep the core. If I am somehow mistaken, someone please correct me!
Last edited by pdjafari; 02-04-2005 at 09:07 AM.
#98
02-04-2005, 09:30 AM
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#99
02-04-2005, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by pdjafari
copbait,
so are you stating that a TS ECU reflash is something that is recommended/required for this mod not to blow your engine?
..
so are you stating that a TS ECU reflash is something that is recommended/required for this mod not to blow your engine?
..
All I implied was someone that runs their car full time on the track is probably doing ECU tuning anyway because they most likely have a lot more mods than just a plenum spacer, and it's so much more critical to have things optimal if you are at or near redline for extended periods of time.
For the vasy majority of everyone else, if a few bolt-ons cause the car to run a tad lean it's usually ok, you are still most likely within the safe range. Most of these cars come a little rich from the factory so a few bolt-ons may actually bring things closer to optimal.
BUT, it really depends on your specific setup, and your specific car. All cars respond differently to even the same mods. Anyone putting performance mods on thier car should know they are probably changing the A/F ratios, so it's up to the owner if they want to bother with it at all. For me personally, I will be doing several mods in the next few weeks, and plan to have my car dynod so I know exactly what is going on, and if any adjustments need to be made I will make that decision then.
Believe me, I would be more than happy to see that the few simple mods I put on is making so much additional power that I'm lean as hell, I could only hope =)
#100
02-04-2005, 01:49 PM
Originally Posted by al503
I'm not calling BS on anything by any means but the A/F graph seems to be a little troubling. Most of the A/F charts I've seen (including mine) have a ratio of around 14:1 (which if I understand correctly is stoich) up until 5000-5500 rpms. At that point, the A/F ratio gets richer which again, if I understand correctly, helps keep the engine cooler (longevity) at the expense of optimum HP output/efficiency.
Although a lean condition on a NA engine isn't as dangerous as one on an engine with FI (running 11:1, 10:1, or even richer at redline), is this something one should worry about?
I honestly don't think it would matter too much for someone doing stoplight racing where the engine is in the upper rev range for very short periods of time but would this be a concern for someone out on the track, road racing, where you spend extended periods of time (all of it ideally) close to redline?
Although a lean condition on a NA engine isn't as dangerous as one on an engine with FI (running 11:1, 10:1, or even richer at redline), is this something one should worry about?
I honestly don't think it would matter too much for someone doing stoplight racing where the engine is in the upper rev range for very short periods of time but would this be a concern for someone out on the track, road racing, where you spend extended periods of time (all of it ideally) close to redline?
But, if you look at his stock fuel ratio graph it is almost identical to that of the spacer or plenum--it runs almost right along with the spacer and plenum graphs--and if I'm not mistaken that car has headers etc. as well(?).
#101
02-04-2005, 01:55 PM
Originally Posted by al503
I'm not calling BS on anything by any means but the A/F graph seems to be a little troubling. Most of the A/F charts I've seen (including mine) have a ratio of around 14:1 (which if I understand correctly is stoich) up until 5000-5500 rpms. At that point, the A/F ratio gets richer which again, if I understand correctly, helps keep the engine cooler (longevity) at the expense of optimum HP output/efficiency.
Although a lean condition on a NA engine isn't as dangerous as one on an engine with FI (running 11:1, 10:1, or even richer at redline), is this something one should worry about?
I honestly don't think it would matter too much for someone doing stoplight racing where the engine is in the upper rev range for very short periods of time but would this be a concern for someone out on the track, road racing, where you spend extended periods of time (all of it ideally) close to redline?
Although a lean condition on a NA engine isn't as dangerous as one on an engine with FI (running 11:1, 10:1, or even richer at redline), is this something one should worry about?
I honestly don't think it would matter too much for someone doing stoplight racing where the engine is in the upper rev range for very short periods of time but would this be a concern for someone out on the track, road racing, where you spend extended periods of time (all of it ideally) close to redline?
#102
02-04-2005, 02:13 PM
Originally Posted by copbait
Jesus if that isn't the most ridiculous twisting of words I have ever seen...
All I implied was someone that runs their car full time on the track is probably doing ECU tuning anyway because they most likely have a lot more mods than just a plenum spacer, and it's so much more critical to have things optimal if you are at or near redline for extended periods of time.
For the vasy majority of everyone else, if a few bolt-ons cause the car to run a tad lean it's usually ok, you are still most likely within the safe range. Most of these cars come a little rich from the factory so a few bolt-ons may actually bring things closer to optimal.
BUT, it really depends on your specific setup, and your specific car. All cars respond differently to even the same mods. Anyone putting performance mods on thier car should know they are probably changing the A/F ratios, so it's up to the owner if they want to bother with it at all. For me personally, I will be doing several mods in the next few weeks, and plan to have my car dynod so I know exactly what is going on, and if any adjustments need to be made I will make that decision then.
Believe me, I would be more than happy to see that the few simple mods I put on is making so much additional power that I'm lean as hell, I could only hope =)
All I implied was someone that runs their car full time on the track is probably doing ECU tuning anyway because they most likely have a lot more mods than just a plenum spacer, and it's so much more critical to have things optimal if you are at or near redline for extended periods of time.
For the vasy majority of everyone else, if a few bolt-ons cause the car to run a tad lean it's usually ok, you are still most likely within the safe range. Most of these cars come a little rich from the factory so a few bolt-ons may actually bring things closer to optimal.
BUT, it really depends on your specific setup, and your specific car. All cars respond differently to even the same mods. Anyone putting performance mods on thier car should know they are probably changing the A/F ratios, so it's up to the owner if they want to bother with it at all. For me personally, I will be doing several mods in the next few weeks, and plan to have my car dynod so I know exactly what is going on, and if any adjustments need to be made I will make that decision then.
Believe me, I would be more than happy to see that the few simple mods I put on is making so much additional power that I'm lean as hell, I could only hope =)
#103
02-04-2005, 02:14 PM
Originally Posted by g35audioman
A good point has been raised. Hopefully hydrazine can chime in here.....
Information on plenum spacers is actually spread out on many different boards and threads. I've attached links to some of them but there are actually many more.
These links should answer most of everyones questions. Many, many dyno runs are in the links too. You will find some of the Q&A to be redundant from board to board but at least a good data base is building. I have also been getting feedback from customers and everything has been positive.
Tony
Links:
http://www.350zmotoring.com/forums/s...=speed+headers
http://www.350zmotoring.com/forums/s...5&pagenumber=1
http://www.350zmotoring.com/forums/s...=Plenum+Spacer
http://www.350zmotoring.com/forums/s...=Plenum+Spacer
http://www.my350z.com/forum/showthre...hreadid=108035
See this page for more specifics on A/F questions.
http://www.350zmotoring.com/forums/s...7&pagenumber=3
PS more independant dynos will be available soon!
#104
02-04-2005, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by pdjafari
chill bro, calm down. I was just asking a question. In case you didnt notice I was #6 on the list of 50+ people to purchase (im not knocking the spacer) I just know that you have been posting on this thread as well as the one on my350z and assumed you 'must know your stuff' telling the guy 'if your so serious' etc etc... No need to get your panties in a knot. Anyways, I looked at the A/F chart and as EK stated they arent far off from Crawford plenum A/f specs anyhow....
#105
02-04-2005, 07:29 PM
