I have done plenty of searching on this subject, but haven't found any posts containing any real numbers beyond speculation. Maybe there were some I missed, but there are sooooo many that have no numerical proof that the camber will stay in specs.

Has anyone mounted OEM 350z springs on a G35 coupe (not Sedan), performaned an alignment? Was the camber in spec? If so, was it closer to the edge, or was it closer to "nominal?"

I'd like to add the 1/2" drop provided by the 350z springs, but want to be sure I don't have to redo my camber by buying more equipment. Anyone done this on a coupe?

Thanks,

Mike

 

My specs

camber front
-1.1/-1.4

camber rear
-1.3/-1.3 by choice, it was the most they could GIVE me, I was looking for -1.6

 

My specs G35 Coupe

camber front -- closer to the edge (but not that much)
-1.5/-1.7

camber rear -- near "nominal"
-1.8/-1.9

TC

 

Im not sure why people even consider dropping the car 1/2" when it's not
even noticable to most people. I would just keep it stock height if I wasn't
aiming for at least 1inch drop for dressup reasons...but that's just me.

In other words, if you're going for performance, keep it stock height.

 

Thanks for you inputs Gsedan35 and TCFOOL!

I found the coupe specs and it lists as follows:

front:
min/max/nominal (degrees)
-1.25/+.25/-.50

and rear
min/max/nominal
-1.75/-.75/-1.25

I was afraid it would push the camber that far. I know this is desireabe for a racing setup, but I'm concerned with tire wear. Have you noticed any excess wear on the insides of your tires?

kenchan - my reasoning is mostly from a cost-driven approach. Yeah, I'd like to drop 1.5" or so, but in doing so it is certain I'd need to get the camber arms, just as you have, and that isn't really high in my priorities to spend that kind of $$. I plan to do my share of autox in my coupe over the next few years. Body roll and weight transfer are a function of the height of the car's center of gravity. I know half an inch isn't much, but it will make a difference when you're talking about lowering ~2500lbs. Every little bit helps in autocross. Maybe the others have different reasons, but thats my deal.

Mike

P.S. If anyone else has their alignment info, feel free to post! I know I said coupes in the first post, but you sedan guys should chime in too--just indicate what car you're talking about. Thanks!

 

i read on this forum that if u drop more than 3/4 of an inch you will need the camber arms, etc if you want to keep oem spec alignment...

 

Specs for my coupe
front camber -1.4 (both)
rear camber -1.6 (both)

 

It's not necessary to get any of the camber arms or kits. I was able to get my G back into spec after dropping it with the Tein S-Tech. It cost me $300 at a local chassis shop (Miami area). They have come up with a was to groove the slots in the factory pieces so that no aftermarket pieces are necessary. I had it done to my last car and it came out perfect. They give you a 1 year warranty and within that one year you can go back and get unlimited alignments. I am running 20" with 255's upfront and 285's in the rear and with these specs I have no rubbing issues.
My Specs:
Front -.65L -.67R
Rear -1.3L -1.25R

 

A 1.2" front drop and that's the front camber spec, something isn't right. No one else drops that much and manages after specs anywhere close to that. Either they aligned your 20's when they lacked to ability to accurately do so or the tech didn't know what he was doing. No way a G can drop 1.2" and have those camber specs and the alignment be accurate. Meaning it's a disservice to the community to claim aftermarket correction is not needed.

 

gsedan35- He probably got his car aligned right after the S-tech install and the
springs were not settled at all. His car is completely out of alignment by now.
One should assume: -1.8 F -3.5 R range with only factory adjustment with
proper toe-in.

crazymike- imho on this car, the loss you get from the lower roll center and
alignment changes is much greater than the gain from lowering the CG.

Basically how I look at it is if you lower the G35C with just springs,
you are at a loss in terms of performance. Then people buy swaybars and
alignment rods to compensate for the loss while gaining a little better than
stock capabilities. If you're dressing up the car like me and only asking for
moderate levels of performance, that's great...but if you're looking to autox
on a budget, you're probably better of just getting F/R swaybars and
even stickier tires.

 

Actually if you read the whole post you would have realized that the alignment is correct. The alignment was done after a week and half to let the springs settle. What they do is cut grooves into the factory mounting points of the camber arms and re-weld them after they have been adjusted. The tach the bolts so that it could stay but can be changed at a later time. This all done a custom chassis shop that is able to do this custom performance alignment. It is called a camber correction.

 

kenchan - maybe I'm missing something here, but how is a lower roll center and slightly more negative camber a loss in performance? Lower roll centers improve handling performace. If that wasn't the case formula cars would have 8" lift kits

In the beginning cars were lowered to gain performace. It then became a look people associated with fast cars, so more people opt to get their cars lowered (not necessarily for performance).

Now obviously there are limitations, but for autox a -2 degree camber is preferred over -1 degree. This is not preferred for straight line racing or street driving though, because it makes the insides of the tires contact more when driving in a straight line or in a normal manner. Tire wear is a concern when you start getting significantly more negative camber than -1 degree.

Sway bars help in both cases, but should be more significant in a non-lowered car.

Am I way off here?

 

The only shop I know that does this is Miami Chassis and Alignment. If you just drive around town and don't plan on keeping the car for more than a few years, I guess this method is OK. For me the 350Evo camber arms was the only way to go because I drive hard and want to keep my ride for a long time.

Also, if this is the same shop you used, just know that they did not align my car properly AFTER I had the 350Evo arms and SPC rear camber kit installed. Moroever, this shop did not have a torque wrench to properly torque the bolts on the control arms sliding mechanism after they set it. My normal shop happened to be full, and I wanted the alignment in a hurry so I took my car to Miami Chassis. After quickly realizing my alignment was still off, I took it to my normal place later and they spent the time and effort to get it right.

I'm not trying to flame the way you did it, but I don't think it's fair to say aftermarket arms are not needed.

 

crazymike - You can't compare your car to a race car... they are built
under the similar principles, but geometry and purpose is completely
different.

Actually you need to raise the roll center to its original height
inorder to maintain the factory suspension geometry when you lower
your car. The car basically rolls more when you just lower the
roll center...what you're doing is lowering the left/right roll axis point
so the car ends up swaying more than stock over the bigger arch
of the sway. My explanation isn't that great..Im sure CKwik or
Gsedan35 can explain in much better terms.

The reason most lowering springs come with higher spring rate is
not only to stiffen the stroke so that the strut does not bottom out,
but to control the sway resulting from the altered roll center. It's a
compromise. The 350Z springs are the same rates as the coupe, but
the strut/shock valving of the coupe is much softer than the 350z
meaning that your car is more susceptible to going outside the
suspension's programmed tolerance since you're already 0.5" lower
and reaching closer to the outer limits of tolerance even before you
count your weight.

If you minimize the movement of the strut on a lowered coupe
within the geometry you want to achieve, you can get better
performance results with compromise to ride comfort...but you say
you're on a budget... you'll need much stiffer springs and much
higher capacity dampers than your stockers inorder to achieve this.

If your car's suspension arms aren't going to move much, your
preferred -2 camber is probably one of the ideal setups...but with your
350Z springs and stock struts, your car is going to roll quite a bit to
a point you are completely out of the tolerance of the suspension
geometry..that's why I say to keep it stock height so that you have
better margin to be within the factory programmed geometry at
the extreme lateral g (or over big bumps). Getting swaybars and
stiffer struts/shocks will help support the car from going out of its programmed tolerance...basically, that's what Im doing with the
swaybars and D-Specs...to make the sus arms move less so that it
won't go any further outside the tolerance.

You're not off, most people preceive lowering a car = higher performance.
It is not directly related with 'just lowering.' You need to control the other
variables in order to make it handle better. most of the time, people are
making their cars handle worse by using just lowering springs. You will
be better off getting front camber arms and set your F/R camber to your
driving needs if you're set on the -2 camber.

 

We're essentially talking the same language here.

Guess I should have mentioned in the first post: I have already purchased the F/R sways, and have some Tokico D-Specs waiting in the garage. I've got some autocross rims/tires ready for order. The next possible thing for me is the addition of springs. I want to keep ride quality as close to stock as possible for street driving. The closest thing for me is the 350z springs.

I don't have the $$ for camber arms right now, so I'm trying to find out if the 350z springs are feasible or not. Understood that lowering the car also decreases the suspension travel, and thus stiffer springs are used to compensate. 1/2" shouldnt be enough loss in travel to really notice as I've never bottomed my coupe out as is...

The bottom line for me now is that looking at the camber specs posted by the folks above (thanks to everyone!), I'm starting to shy away from the 350z springs after all, since the camber is pretty much just out of spec (or on the edge) after installation. I want to keep longevity in my street tires, so having my camber out of the spec range isn't too favorable. I'm probably going to hold off for a year or two until I can save enough cash for a camber kit and likely some better springs at that time. Getting the 350z springs, 1/2" drop with no camber issues is what I want but isn't looking too realistic anymore...