My 2006 G Sedan has about 75K on it and the brakes are talking to me. I was thinking of swapping the front & rear rotors and pads, but have a couple of questions.

I have never been completely happy with the brakes on the G35. It is a heavy car and the brakes are pretty weak. It seems like one good stop, on fresh brakes, the rotors warp. Also the brake pedal is very mushy, perhaps it's the crappy DOT 3 fluid and junky pads? So if I'm thinking of doing all 4 corners and a little upgrading too.

1.) How do the rotors come off? I'm worked on mostly Honda's some old school Fords. It looks like I remove the caliper (two bolts), then pop the rotor (Honda style). Is it that simple, or do I have deal with (Ford style) wheel bearings/grease and other crap?

2.) I have run Hawk racing pads on a race car and a street car. They are not good for daily driving. Although they stop like nobodies business though, they are very noisy, dirty, and tear up the rotors. Also the first stop in the morning is always exciting!

I currently run Porterfield R4S Pads in my track car. They are a very good compromise for street/track performance. They are a little delicate for the track and very substantial for daily driving. Generally I'm pretty happy with them. Any other recommendations?

3.) Any recommendation on rotors? OEM, Drills/Slotted, Ceramic? Keep in mind that I don't want to spend $200/wheel, but I could live with $100 for a quality rotor that will last a while.

4.) Any issues with using a Vacula (brake line sucker) for bleeding?

5.) Comments, questions, answers are welcome.

Thanks,
Jerold

 

Calipers come off with 2 bolts and the rotors pop off.

Porterfield R4S is my daily pad, I use their ceramic track pad only on the track. Many people here use Hawks street pad and love it so maybe look into that. You shouldn't have any squealing issues as long as it's not their track pad and you break them in properly.

Just use oem or slotted. Don't get drilled.

I had my system bled with a brake bleeder and it was awesome, made it so much easier.

 

Good news on the rotors, nice and easy.

I was also thinking that SS Brake lines may firm up the pedal a bit. They aren't that expensive either. A bit more mess but I will probably purge the fluid anyway.

I bought one of these. Well worth the $$ if you track your car.

Thanks!

 

Rotors do not warp. The braking vibration you feel is simply thickness variation(TV) caused by uneven brake pad material stuck on the rotor. This can be greatly reduced or vastly eliminated by proper bed-in of brake pads.

TV is parimarily casued by improper run-out of the brake rotor. Rotors must be indexed for run-out. It is required by the factory, as written on black and white. Failure to perform run-out indexing translates to poor installation.

Run-out measurement outlined on the FSM:


My 2005 G35 Sedan has run-out of close to 0.000" and I have no vibration even after 20,000 miles of hard braking. Even 0.002" of run-out on our G35 with light weight suspension can feel the brake vibration.


As brake pads wear out and go through heat cycles, their effectiveness go down, causing the mushy pedal feel. Also, as the rotors and pads get thinned, more brake fluid fill caliper piston chamber. This contributes to mushiness.

Moisture in brake fluid also makes the pedal feel soft. The use of high performance brake fluid, from my experience, boosts pedal stiffness over the generic Dot 3 you can buy at auto parts store.

Your Sedan floating calipers are very similar to the Honda calipers. I am not sure which year or model Honda you worked on, but the G35 sedan have almost identical caliper setup to most Hondas.

Honda has a rotor screw that requires an impact driver to remove. Our cars do not. [/QUOTE]

Brake pads choice is mainly based on personal preference. If I were to make a suggestion, I would go with Hawk HPS.

MOST people who complain about noise and bad initial bites are people who installed and bed-in the pads incorrectly. With proper installation and bed-in, brand new Hawk HPS outperforms brand new OEM in initial bite.

Proper indexing of rotors also makes your brake system more responsive as the rotors are being grabbed more effectively.

I have used a large variety of rotors. With proper installation, bed-in, and run-out indexing, any high quality rotors would yield excellent results. I have used Raybestos Professional Grade rotors with excellent results. They are also fairly cheap and more heat resistent than the OEM rotors. EBC rotors are also extremely good.

Of course, you can go with any high quality rotors you like. Just make sure they are installed correctly and you will not have any problems.



I would go with the traditional method suggested by the FSM. However, Vacula type brake bleeding devices are used by many with good results.

Proper installation is key.

Most people with brake problems (such as shimmy, squealing, and poor response) are those who did not install their brakes correctly. Follow the manufacturer's run-out procedure and lubrication diagram and you will not have any issues.

Thanks,
Jerold[/QUOTE]

 

Thanks for the info. Keep in mind this is my daily driver, I don't beat on it . . . that much.

I totally agree that installation and break in is important to any mechanical part. Honestly I have not checked the run out. I have about 75K on the brakes. They are the original OEM pads & rotors installed from the factory. I was careful with the car for the first 1k miles and bedded the pads a well. I'm not sure I did exactly what they spec'd, but it was 75K ago so it wasn't terrible. At 75K I'm willing to chuck the rotors, they have served me well. Until now just about everything beside the basics was done at the dealer. It's warranty up, so now I can have some fun.

So what I'm feeling is little pieces of the crappy OEM pads melted to my rotors? Could it be that the melted pads create and inconsistent adhesion, so the remaining pad has a different coefficient of friction depending on the angle of the rotor? It's a shake/shimmy not a brake pedal pulse.

I had a CRX had non-vented rotors (single blade), they would actually warp. I have also melted the pads as well and boiled fluid. They would get nice and shiny with blue rotors after a day at the track. My Type R had similar issues with pads so I swapped them out and upgraded to DOT 5. I'm not tracking the G though so I'm just looking for a competent braking system, which it lacks.

I also discovered that improper/uneven torque on the lugs would almost instantly warp the rotors even on my Wifes Accord. Now I bring a torque wrench with me to whatever shop has touched my car and check it right there. The Nissan rotors are vented and probably stiffer too. Seems to solve a lot of problems.

I have never been happy with the pedal feel from day one. The vacuum boost will actually allow me to press the pedal to the floor if I keep moderate pressure on it. I took it to the dealer an they told "That's normal don't do that." I will purge the lines and moving to a quality DOT 4, and possibly SS brake lines too.

Excellent! It sounds like a couple of hours on the ground at most. I'm not into packing wheel bearings.

This was only an issue with full race pads. They are noisy, dirty, need time to warm up, and will tear up your rotors bad. No one cares if you sound like a freight train at the track, but I can't have customers in my car and sound like that. I have not had any issue with the Porterfield R4-S, rock solid. I just bleed the brakes twice a year.

Thanks,
Jerold

 

You got it!


Just keep in mind that bad suspension parts (namely the compression bushing and tie rod ends) can also cause a shimmy under heavy braking. Before you proceed replacing any brake components, make sure the suspension parts are in good working condition.


Many performance street pads should serve you well. Which brand or model to choose is mainly based on your own preference. Make sure you lube all the contact points on your new brake pads and the street pads will not squeal.

Again, I advise that you measure and index run-out on your next brake install to maximize the life and performance of your brakes. You can buy a dial gauge and mount for a very reasonable price. The difference between 0.003" and 0.001" of runout can be a night and day difference in terms of shimmy.

 

Now that you mention it, out of true could be a bent hub/spindle or other stuff too. I used to drive a Ford Capri, the shimmy was normal because the rack bushing would blow out all the time. The characteristic of the shimmy is it's like a band of midgets brake dancing on my hood when under mild or light braking at freeway speeds. It does not happen at low speed or heavy braking. Under heavy braking it brakes smooth and straight. So I highly expect that it's a rotor issue.

Good thought on the dial indicator. Thanks to the Chinese, they are not that expensive now a days. New rotors "should" be true, but then again thanks to the Chinese. . . you never know until you check. I can throw it on spin the wheel pretty easily.

Thanks,
Jerold

 

Im unhappy with my brakes too I replace them every year. I would think the dealer knows how to install them. Tyau do you live in NY? I want to replace my pads and rotors and you seem like you know what ur talking about.

 

Update:

I put in EBC USR rotors and Hawk HPS pads.

The midgets are not dancing on my hood anymore. The brakes are quiet and feel much more solid. I will be purging the fluid to ATE Super Blue as well.

A couple of notes on the swap.
1.) The factory caliper hanger bolts are friggen tight. Thats and US torque spec vs the German good-n-tight. An impact wrench helps if you can get it in there.

I didn't have room to use on the rear lower bolts though. I pounded my wrench with a hammer and that did the trick.

2.) The lower caliper pivot bolt won't come out unless your remove the hanger too.

3.) The USR are coated with a black coating. You have to wear that down before you bed the brakes. When you step on the the very first time they almost nothing so be careful.

4.) The Hawk pads for the front did not have the shims, but the rear did. I reused the front ones and saved the rear ones, just in case.

5.) The front spring clips are a pain. After wrestling with it several times I found that if I just stick the pad and the return spring hang out it's easier to put in the return springs. Pull the pad out a little bit, then push the spring in. Don't try to assemble the spring and the pad together.

6.) The front passenger spring clip was misaligned (by me) and it made a horrible noise. Check the alignment of the spring clips and pads before you tighten everything up.

7.) The rear disc takes some incentive to remove them. They had a ring of rust holding them in place. I had use some liquid wrench and beat on them to get it loose.

8.) The lower rear caliper pivots require a wrench. It's too tight for a socket.

I'm sure I missed some tricks. If you have some and want to share please feel free.

 

I just replaced the rear rotors on my car and it was a royal pain to get them off. 79k miles and they were the stock ones. Beating on them with a rubber mallet didn't work, and neither did a hammer (at first). Then a neighbor got an idea to jack the rotor hat up slightly and beat on it with a hammer then, and FINALLY I was able to bust it loose. There was "rust dust" flying everywhere when I did it, lol.

 

Yah mine were stuck good too. I have 78K miles also, so we are consistent. The new rotors have a black coating to it. so maybe the won't rust so much.

I don't mind whacking them, but there isn't much room for it.