Hello folks,

I've got CIPHER which allows me to advance timing 2 degrees I believe.

Any safety issues I need to look out for? (my only perf mods so far are MD Iso thermal spacer + K&N)

Should I keep an eye on the AFR? And make sure it doesn't go over X?

(X = what number?)

The dyno on UPRev's site shows about a 8 hp/torque gain from doing this (on a Titan)...

 

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For a second, I was thinking that was your dyno graph. It was my understanding that the VQ motor has a knock sensor that will optimally set the timing to produce the most power without pinging. However, I'm guessing that Nissan has it set so that there's some margin of safety, so you could technically get some more hp by advancing the timing. 8hp? Maybe not.

 

I heard from a tuner that the stock timing maps are so aggressive that if you advance it 2 degrees, the learning algorithms will just tune it right back out over time. He said they basically just use it to move the timing back 2 degrees for some added safety witih FI. I haven't verified this myself with the Cipher yet.

Regarding safety issues, I wouldn't worry about it. The knock sensors will save you. And your injected AFRs shouldn't change, just the point where the burn starts in the stroke.

 

I've read that advancing the timing via the Consult tool on the VQ35s does absolutely nothing because all it adjusts is the base timing. Once you go WOT, the additional 2 degree advance plays no part in the equation because the ECU pays no attention to base timing at that point.

 

Define "base timing". I would assume that the base timing is something relative to which the maps are defined, so I would expect it to offset the entire shizbang. If you know otherwise please do tell.

 

I don't think that's quite true. More torque IS more horsepower. Torque is a force. Horsepower is power which is force/time. More force over an equal time equals more power.

With regards to what was said earlier, I think base timing is the timing of the spark at idle. The term came from earlier engines where the timing was physically advanced by the amount of vacuum produced by the engine. So the base timing referred to the point where vacuum was the least. As engine rpm increases, the timing of the spark has to advance in order to keep the burn efficiency high. Prior to knock sensors, the advance of the timing was just an estimate. That's why advancing the timing on a 5.0 Mustang was worth 10hp. The factory setting was too conservative. Now a days with knock sensors, an engine can run closer to that optimum timing without much danger.

 

I think what is normally meant by "more torque" or "more horsepower" is "more low-end torque" or "more high-end torque", the latter translating to more peak horsepower.

And torque is a moment, not a force. And power is work over time, not force over time. More force over the same distance over an equal time equals more power. Not that this is really relevant to the discussion, but I wanted to clear that up.

 

On Boxing Day I had Cipher advance timing to 17 degrees. I thought I felt difference. Any gain was not as when ½” MD spacer was installed. But it could also have been placebo effect. Month latter, I had half a tank of 91 octane gasoline put by mistake and then filled up with 93 octane. Few days after I had P0303 DTC. It might be related or not, regardless, I changed it back to 15.

 

I have a GTech so I could test it. I didn't expect much - just wanted to be sure it wasn't going to harm anything.

dovla, not sure what that code is -> I don't think 91 octane should have caused it, that's still "premium" fuel.

Hmmm.... thinking no point pursuing this.